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Teegate

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Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
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Check out this video. It is obvious the people in the vehicles do not know who Jason is.

 
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Jon Holcombe

Explorer
Dec 1, 2015
851
1,675
Medford
Guys driving up from Virginia to tear up the roads in a $500 beater. What Jason said seems rational to me. Are the roads in worse shape now than they were 40 years ago? Just curious.
 

imkms

Explorer
Feb 18, 2008
510
131
SJ and SW FL
Guys driving up from Virginia to tear up the roads in a $500 beater. What Jason said seems rational to me. Are the roads in worse shape now than they were 40 years ago? Just curious.
Many of the roads are worse today than 40 years ago. There are some roads that I used to travel in a 2 wheel vehicle that are now inaccessible to even most 4x4s. Some of these roads have been so destroyed by many vehicle caused dips, that they are impossible to drive on or often flooded. Today, even some of the big puddle bypasses have been ripped up by vehicles.
 

Jon Holcombe

Explorer
Dec 1, 2015
851
1,675
Medford
Many of the roads are worse today than 40 years ago. There are some roads that I used to travel in a 2 wheel vehicle that are now inaccessible to even most 4x4s. Some of these roads have been so destroyed by many vehicle caused dips, that they are impossible to drive on or often flooded. Today, even some of the big puddle bypasses have been ripped up by vehicles.
It would be nice to drive down the east side of our mighty river, but this time of year it's impassable, even a short distance down from Rt 206 there are massive puddles. Quakerbridge Rd was recently re-graded and a month later there are already deep ruts and puddles.

I understand that Wharton needs a bigger budget, for maintenance and DEP needs more PP manpower.

A Permit System could help weed out out-of-state mudders. I hesitate to use that inflammatory term on this forum, but I see it with my own eyeballs all the time. I saw a guy with a lifted F-150 and huge tires stuck on the east side of the mighty river. The people on this forum, hunters, history buffs, science and nature lovers, photographers, fisherman, etc., are using the roads to go someplace. To get to a destination. They aren't generally joy riding and (to use another controversial phrase) "challenging" the roads.

I've been exploring the T Creek west and south of Friendship recently. Manumuskin was kind enough to provide me with multiple maps and descriptive information on how to access it a few years back.

That Creek is in many ways, the heart of the Pine Barrens, a beautiful stream lined by Cedar with islands and waterfowl. But driving there is getting increasingly sketchy. Wharton resurfaces trouble spots on HB occasionally, for which I am grateful.

But if there is a way to cut back on traffic, especially those who just want to spin their tires and dive into big puddles, I am all for it.
 
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Broke Jeep Joe

Explorer
Mar 8, 2006
665
351
Waterford Twp
Guys driving up from Virginia to tear up the roads in a $500 beater. What Jason said seems rational to me. Are the roads in worse shape now than they were 40 years ago? Just curious.
I had been sent this video earlier this month and was reluctant to post it. It is from the "mud in the pines" movie. If you notice, the Cherokee in the pic has Jersey plates, not VA. I'll leave the group come to their own decision about where those kids are from, but you are not driving up from VA, purchasing a beater and registering it in a weekend these days. I like how Jason videos their actions but blurs the plates out, maybe its a legality in movie making. Also, taking the video out of the equation, what could the SPP do in that situation? The Jeep is on a road, in a hole, granted not the smartest individuals but they are really doing nothing wrong at that point to the eye. Before that, yes but at that moment no. Also, does anyone know why he removed the pink blaze from the fire break he was standing in? I would not like a permit system for in state users, I think we pay enough for enough here. Basing access on hunting licenses is not fair to non-hunters either. There needs to be a way to accomplish access for all that want to use the pines without owning a Sherman Tank or paying for a fancy window sticker no one will see.
 

popeofthepines

Explorer
Mar 8, 2006
187
63
Atco
I think that the youtube/internet generation has exposed the Pines to too many outsiders who think it is just a place to come and play and they are not aware of the sensitive biosphere that is the PInes and how people enjoy it many, many different ways.
I have been rolling around and exploring the Pines for almost 30 years (wow I just said to myself lol) and the roads were better before and have gotten worse quicker over the years. But there are also areas that are always bad because of where the road is. I don't take chances because I am always wondering what a-hole may have rutted the puddle to screw the next guy.
I just wonder how would you effectively enforce a permit system with so many entrances to the Pines? There cannot be a person at every entrance checking for permits and selling them if needed. And what about the people who are camping, do they need another permit to travel the roads while camping?
Yes i agree they need more funds for maintenance and enforcement. And a permit system would be a way for them to get some of that money.

I am just not sure how it would work for all parties and until that is figured out, I cannot see one being enacted.
 

Gibby

Piney
Apr 4, 2011
1,604
396
Trenton
In my youth, when I was a hardcore mountain bike rider and racer, the group I trained with use to do this thing called trail maintenance. Does anyone even do such a thing anymore? Taking care of the areas we road through and beat up, kept us on the trails and everyone else who used Fairmount Park and several other areas happy. It took effort but maintenance worked. I used to grab people passing by to help.

I am just day dreaming.
 
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1Jerseydevil

Explorer
Feb 14, 2009
527
187
In my youth, when I was a hardcore mountain bike rider and racer, the group I trained with use to do this thing called trail maintenance. Does anyone even do such a thing anymore? Taking care of the areas we road through and beat up, kept us on the trails and everyone else who used Fairmount Park and several other areas happy. It took effort but maintenance worked. I used to grab people passing by to help.

I am just day dreaming.
Doesn't work in the Pines. For years motorcycle clubs participated in cleanups with gun clubs, PPA and other interests. When asked to clean and extend the Batona trail it was done with no help from others. A rather long bridge was built with pilings when asked only to be scorned and spit on. Other efforts were made only to have the same results as in the past. After being hit in the head many times the clubs finally realized all efforts to "get along" with other groups is fruitless.
 

slingblade

New Member
Sep 15, 2016
20
17
MakePeace Lake NJ
In my youth, when I was a hardcore mountain bike rider and racer, the group I trained with use to do this thing called trail maintenance. Does anyone even do such a thing anymore? Taking care of the areas we road through and beat up, kept us on the trails and everyone else who used Fairmount Park and several other areas happy. It took effort but maintenance worked. I used to grab people passing by to help.

I am just day dreaming.
An off-road bicycle association chapter maintains the MTB trails. An outdoor club maintains the hiking trails. Trail maintenance is supervised by staff.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but due to the increased traffic. I believe maintenance of the sand roads these days would require more/frequent use of heavy equipment than was used in the past.
 
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WaretownMike

Explorer
Jul 16, 2013
189
93
50
Waretown
Doesn't work in the Pines. For years motorcycle clubs participated in cleanups with gun clubs, PPA and other interests. When asked to clean and extend the Batona trail it was done with no help from others. A rather long bridge was built with pilings when asked only to be scorned and spit on. Other efforts were made only to have the same results as in the past. After being hit in the head many times the clubs finally realized all efforts to "get along" with other groups is fruitless.
Why would a user-group participate while banned from using the trail or road? How do you look at this as the non-pedestrian user groups not getting along while you’re banning them? Maybe I’m missing something? You’re upset they won’t help but don’t seem to see why.

I personally spend dozens of hours every year building or maintaining trails that I’m allowed to use, but will not lift a finger to help those that actively oppose and legislate against my user-groups activities.
 
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