ATVs continue wild illegal joyrides through the NJ Pine Barrens
Conservationists concerned that many sensitive environmental areas in NJ are getting destroyed. Why isn’t something being done?
ATVs continue wild illegal joyrides through the NJ Pine Barrens
- Thread starter Teegate
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"DEP is discussing the development of a permit system for use of unimproved roads in Wharton State Forest, modeled off the department’s experience implementing the Mobile Sport Fishing Vehicle Permit system at Island Beach State Park," the DEP spokesman said.
That is exactly what I suggested on the Pine Barrens Land Defense Facebook page. Along with increased and active law enforcement, and a reasonable Motorized Access Plan, I think that would help a lot.
That is exactly what I suggested on the Pine Barrens Land Defense Facebook page. Along with increased and active law enforcement, and a reasonable Motorized Access Plan, I think that would help a lot.
But active law enforcement needs to be the first step, well ahead, and not 2nd to a MAP
If the 1st step happened there may be no need for a 2nd!
Without the 1st, the 2nd is useless
Can someone explain how?
State authorities need to first address the issue of complicity. Cops, or their friends or family are themselves engaged in illegal riding. They need to clean that up.
How is the state going to connect the cops to their friends and family? I would not want to be the DEP or park police employee who calls them all in and tells them to rat people out.
It’s a whole lot easier to control an area like Island Beach Park, with its one way in and out and authorities that only have to cover a very small area vs. the million acres within the Pines.
Absolutely true. But as Russ has pointed out, Park Police do not write tickets, there isn't a big enough force, laws need to be tougher on violators. And a permit system should cut down on traffic in the forest, especially if you make the fee for out of state double then the fee for NJ residents.
DEP seems to have forgotten that they are the Department for Environmental Protection.
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It appears we all agree that the SPP is quite understaffed, while I do not know the exact staffing model or number employed it appears to be fact. With their focus/directive/whatever you want to call it on places like historic areas, campgrounds, rec areas, beaches, rivers etc. and with a rotation based schedule I cant imagine what some of them feel when rotating into Wharton or Lebanon and attempt to patrol, overwhelming to say the least. Granted they should be prepared for it, however, I am not sure of their attrition rates, or frequency of rotation. I do know from speaking to some of them they use the SPP as a stepping stone to other law enforcement career paths. My point being before we collectively say what we assume they are not doing, we should look at what they are doing. Armchair QB is an easy job, boots on the ground is not as easy.
I'm a strong supporter of our law enforcement folks, and I think we owe them our deepest respect and appreciation. At the same time, they are public servants--our employees, so if they're going down a wrong track, we have a right to point it out. I don't want anyone ratted out, or punished, or embarrassed. I just want the heads of the various law enforcement agencies to recognize that this trend of complicity, sympathy, and leniency is unacceptable. It's up to the people at the top to change the course.
Good points! They are definitely understaffed, and that's one of the main issues being taken up in #FixOurParks. At the same time, records show that they only wrote two tickets specific to illegal ORV activity in WSF in all of 2021. I have also seen with my own eyes that both state police and state park police are extremely reluctant to write tickets even when the perpetrators are standing right in front of them, even when the perpetrators are trespassing on private land.
So one extreme to another, I received a seat belt ticket from the SPP, there are extreme examples of each situation. Just be careful what we wish for is all I am conveying. I also dislike the term public servant they are public employees that protect and serve, not our servants.
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If current laws are not enforced adding more laws does nothing.
Same with a potentially unenforced permit system. It'll just cost you and I money...
I'm probably not alone with having a hard time agreeing to a MAP, permit, closures, ect when what we already have on the books is ignored.
Who owns the roads? If a local municipality can give someone permission to close off and police a road however that see fit located within Wharton then it’s not the DEP that does. How can the DEP charge a fee for roads that they don’t own 100%?
Yes, the permitting system would have to be enforced, otherwise it will be pointless. Our DEP Commissioner, Shawn LaTourette has been saying that law enforcement is on his agenda. So, those of us who agree that the current regulations and laws should be enforced should encourage him to do that.
A map would help identify where people can legally take motor vehicles. Right now, there is ambiguity, so that would resolve the ambiguity.
We have to make some very simple distinctions about "road closures." Some of the avenues of travel being used out there are actually not legitimate roads. A good example is lanes opened up by the forest fire service in the course of fighting fires. Those are not legitimate roads. Every law-abiding citizen should agree that they should be closed. The same is true for illegally-created ATV and dirt bike trails. They should be closed, because they were never permitted in the first place.
If they closed some or all of the roads you mention we would not need a map to tell us where to go. Just saying!
Yeah, that's a good point. But I guess it raises the question of what is meant by "closing." I can think of three ways to "close" a road or illegal avenue. (1) put up a physical barricade (which, in most cases, could be destroyed or circumvented); (2) put up signage (which could be ignored and/or vandalized); (3) indicate it closed by not including it on a map designating the legal road system (which, of course, could be easily ignored, too). Or, for that matter, authorities could do all three. But, as others have emphasized, nothing is going to work unless we get effective law enforcement.
The second line in the article states:
An increasing number of all-terrain vehicles, ATVs, continue to illegally roar through forests, wetlands and other environmentally sensitive areas, doing all sorts of serious damage and disturbing the peace.
ATVs are already illegal on all state land. Let’s start there before we create new laws, maps, permits or closures.
An increasing number of all-terrain vehicles, ATVs, continue to illegally roar through forests, wetlands and other environmentally sensitive areas, doing all sorts of serious damage and disturbing the peace.
ATVs are already illegal on all state land. Let’s start there before we create new laws, maps, permits or closures.
If future mandates require all vehicles to be electric won't this problem solve itself? The minute these illegal off-roaders drive through a puddle they will be electrocuted.
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