Exploding Deer Population

[dragoncjo]

Just curious if anyone is noticing that there are just a ton of deer in the pines this year. A buddy of mine mentioned to me how he has been seeing so many more deer up here and I agree. Yesterday I was tracking a snake and driving around the pines for the better part of the day and must have seen over 30 deer, many of which were with young. I'm also seeing a real high amount of bucks this year, some unusually big ones too for the pines. Is there something in the biology of deer that makes them more noticable or out and about this time of year? I've had people swear to me that deer are becoming rarer in the pines because of yotes or other reason.....I'm not seeing this at all.

 

[Teegate]

Yes, I agree the population is coming back. About 10 years ago we would see them around every turn, but the past few years that was not the norm. Now it is. I saw a bunch yesterday.

Guy

 

[dragoncjo]

Yeah I think my buddy and I saw about 10 in less then one hour of driving. They seem to be abundant in one particular area....but I don't want to mention it publicly.

 

[Hewey]

Tracey and I had the Jeep out in Greenwood Sunday evening for a ride and we saw 15 deer in about an hour. 4 of them we could tell were buck.

I have seen less coyote tracks in the woods this year compared to years past.

Chris

 

[bobpbx]

Tracey and I had the Jeep out in Greenwood Sunday evening for a ride and we saw 15 deer in about an hour. 4 of them we could tell were buck.

I have seen less coyote tracks in the woods this year compared to years past.

Chris

Remember the dead coyotes I found in Greenwood, one with the head cut off? I do believe there is a guy trapping them and doing that. I'd rather see a natural population of deer culled by coyote than promotion of hunting on sundays and within 150 feet of homes. Maybe this is a case where coyote trappers are causing the deer population to increase.

 

[ecampbell]

Yes, alot of bucks, some still in velvet. They are on the move wich is making it easier to see them. Watch your speed.

 

[RednekF350]

I am only seeing a slight recovery down here.
Blue tongue wiped out a lot of our deer here and in the Atsion area several years ago and they have been extremely slow to bounce back.

One thing that will start to help us here is the shifting of the zone boundary between 25 and 23.
Zone 25 is a brown and down zone and it has been shifted away from 206 and the Albertson Branch in parts of Waterford, Winslow and Hammonton.
One member of a local gun club here got the ball rolling and the Camden County Chapter of the NJ Federation of Sportsmen's Clubs' network of NJF&W representatives were instrumental in getting the shift accomplished.
Last year was the first year for the change so I think it will be a few more years to see the positive effect in this area.

Now, if we can only put the brakes on in 19.

 

[cranbrake]

After my last trip I now have no doubt the amount of whitetails seen in the pines this year alone probably triples all I'd seen in the last 6-7 years combined.In two days I saw 4 buck(all sixpointers or better) and maybe 20 doe and immatures/juveniles,being conservative. Also at least one more buck DOR on a hiway(i think the turnpike).Can't say my sightings were really concentrated in any one area more than another.

Considering population densities I've seen of these animals in suburban,even urban settings- I'm guessing an ecosystem like the pines could potentially support numbers of them that would make what we're starting to see now look like a drop in a bucket before their population would crash or drop off significantly.There's just not enough predators of them out there.

I'm concerned about what effects they would have on other wildlife,esp. all the variation native to the pines they'd compete with.The suburban and urban places I mentioned above were already devoid of much wildlife save for your common generalists and non-natives.

 

[Boyd]

Seems to me that there have been too many deer for quite some time. When I lived in Medford, they really made a mess of the woods, mowing down just about everything they could reach. There do seem to be a lot this year in Atlantic County - almost hit Bambi on a little road near my house this morning in fact.

It really makes me sad to see what they do to the cedar sprouts. My lowlands were obviously a dense cedar forest at one time and I still have a couple nice groves. Every year there are a lot of sprouts and the cedars would grow back on their own if the deer didn't eat them right down to the ground. Some of the tougher sprouts survive, only to be chewed way back again each year so nothing ever really reaches the sapling stage. Maybe someday I will try to fence off a few areas.

 

[cranbrake]

you probably already know about those corrugated plastic tubes you can use to protect the seedlings until they reach the age/size at which they are unappetizaing to the deer(at which point i guess you can just slice them off),but you may wanna give that a shot......

 

[Boyd]

No, I have not really looked into this at all, but it sounds interesting. I was going to try to find some kind of cages or whatever. Do you have any info on these?

 

[cranbrake]

sorry no i don't.it's just something i see all the time and i have been told that the deer love eating young atlantic white cedar saplings,at least to a certain age/size.this option allows you to protect the tree(s) without fencing it off completely(which is obstructive to not just the deer,but all wildlife in/or moving thru the area).....heck you could probably make these yourself,i've seen it usually at about the 4 foot tall mark,i'd check with a local nursery or someone in forestery,even someone with one of the well-known conservation groups in the pines.good luck,keep us posted!

 

[46er]

No, I have not really looked into this at all, but it sounds interesting. I was going to try to find some kind of cages or whatever. Do you have any info on these?

Boyd, the FREC in Jackson or a tree nursery near you should know of them. Also, you might contact Forsythe NWR, they use them with new plantings.

 

[Boyd]

Thanks for the ideas - I will check it out when I can find the time.

 

[Hewey]

Considering population densities I've seen of these animals in suburban,even urban settings- I'm guessing an ecosystem like the pines could potentially support numbers of them that would make what we're starting to see now look like a drop in a bucket before their population would crash or drop off significantly.There's just not enough predators of them out there.

The Pines is actually a poor habitat for whitetail deer. In areas of the country that have large tracts of unbroken forest have some of the lowest deer per square density. I do not think we will ever have a population high enough in the Pines were you would see s browse line. Whitetails need breaks in there habitat, i.e. areas with agriculture and open fields with wood lots. Suburban Monmouth County is a perfect example with agriculture, lush lawns and landscapes to feed on with good safe cover to hide in (behind McMansions).

I would just like to see the days like when I was a kid when any time you walked in the Pines you would kick up deer.

Chris

 

[Pines Lover]

The Pines is actually a poor habitat for whitetail deer. In areas of the country that have large tracts of unbroken forest have some of the lowest deer per square density. I do not think we will ever have a population high enough in the Pines were you would see s browse line. Whitetails need breaks in there habitat, i.e. areas with agriculture and open fields with wood lots. Suburban Monmouth County is a perfect example with agriculture, lush lawns and landscapes to feed on with good safe cover to hide in (behind McMansions).

I would just like to see the days like when I was a kid when any time you walked in the Pines you would kick up deer.

Chris

The pines are full of white tail deer.

Go into any cedar swamp and try to find a young cedar.

The only young cedars that survive are in the cedar swamps that have deer enclosures.

 

[46er]

I do not think we will ever have a population high enough in the Pines were you would see s browse line.
Chris

Take a ride down RT 9 to the power plant. Just past the light look to the east. The cedars there have been browsed to about 5 feet. Been that way for years.

 

[GermanG]

Take a ride down RT 9 to the power plant. Just past the light look to the east. The cedars there have been browsed to about 5 feet. Been that way for years.

I always point out that exact spot to passengers when I drive by as an example of what a confined deer population can do. Another spot is Cattus Island Park, in Toms River, where the "island" part of the park has virtually nothing edible to deer growing below the browse line.

I was at an invasive plant symposium hosted by the NJ Division of Parks & Forestry earlier in the year where deer were identified as one of the biggest single factors causing the expansion of invasive species. In confined suburban forests they concentrate their feeding on preferred native plants, allowing invasives to take over.

 

[Hewey]

The pines are full of white tail deer.

Go into any cedar swamp and try to find a young cedar.

The only young cedars that survive are in the cedar swamps that have deer enclosures.

I wouldn't say full.

You wouldn't find many saplings in a mature cedar swamp due to the lack of sunlight at ground level.

Not true. I know of an area that has alot of young cedar. It was logged off in the 80's. I have been watching them grow. The area has never had a fence.

young cedar all the way to the mature cedar.

Take a ride down RT 9 to the power plant. Just past the light look to the east. The cedars there have been browsed to about 5 feet. Been that way for years.

I know the area you of speak of, GermanG is spot on. I wouldn't consider that area unbroken forest. Go west of the Parkway.

Chris

 

[VP UXBNJ]

Remember the dead coyotes I found in Greenwood, one with the head cut off? I do believe there is a guy trapping them and doing that. I'd rather see a natural population of deer culled by coyote than promotion of hunting on sundays and within 150 feet of homes. Maybe this is a case where coyote trappers are causing the deer population to increase.

Whoa!!! Wait a minute my friend. I think you have it all wrong. Trappers do not cut the heads off any animal and leave the carcass in the woods to feed the rest of the animals. We take the hides and use the meat. Why in the world would we leave the hyde behind? That makes no sense as procuring the hyde is the main part of trapping.

Here comes the harsh part - Your statement is proof you have absolutely no hunting or trapping experience and you should not put your opinion in print as such. I'm a hunter and a trapper. I hunt for the meat to feed my family; which they enjoy the fruits of my labor. I have not ONE animal hanging on the wall, nor do I choose to. So I take very much offense to your statement about hunting and trapping. Without hunters or trappers you might as well open up the book of diseases and pick any one you would like to get.

Also, the 150' rule will help cull the herds that are nuisance deer that are free range in your back yard. You may also want to clear up your statement by regurgitating the rule as it is written. To summarize: The rule is for archery ONLY and the hunter must have WRITTEN permission from the home/dwelling owner and it must be on hand while hunting. Another important part you left out is you have to be elevated and shooting down towards the ground.


The actual print from the 2010 Hunting Digest -
(Tentative) Carrying a bow with a nocked arrow
within 150 feet of an occupied building or 450 feet
of any school playground is prohibited, except the
owner or lessee of a building—and persons specifically
authorized by him in writing (written permission
must be in possession while hunting)—
may hunt within 150 feet of the building. Note: Persons
authorized to hunt within 150 feet of a building
must hunt from an elevated position to shoot down
toward the ground