Gotta' Question

[this_is_nascar]

I've already introduced myself a couple times, so I won't go through that boring story again. Let's just say that I'm a newbie here, as well as being a beginner to wheeling/off-roading. Over the last couple months, I've been doing a bunch of reading of these types of message boards, looking at tons of user pictures and trying to learn as much as I can about the sport.

From what I've read, I don't think I'll ever be able to classify myself as a true "off-roader/4 x4 'er" in the extreme sense of the word. I've seen countless pictures of folks sinking their trucks in the mud, with mud and sludge and water 6-inches deep in the cabin. Some folks appear to do this on purpose, others seem to venture out with the hopes of getting stuck.

When I go out, it's never in the plan to go out of my way to find a spot to get stuck, nor is the quest to find a puddle (which turns out to be a lake) to flood my truck in. I enjoy the unpaved roads, the roads with a nice sandy area and the occasional puddle that one encounters. If an upcoming puddle just doesn't "look or feel right", I simply go around it or turn around.

Now, here comes the questions. How do you folks approach a rather large puddle? What I mean is.......... do you try to figure out how deep the puddle is before entering? Do you avoid it altogether or do you take the chance and "hope" you can get thru it? After seeing many pictures, I've notice some innocent looking puddles that have swallowed half the truck. While I enjoy the obstacles an challenges, I don't ever want to spend the day trying to get unstuck.

 

[Ben Ruset]

Now, here comes the questions. How do you folks approach a rather large puddle? What I mean is.......... do you try to figure out how deep the puddle is before entering? Do you avoid it altogether or do you take the chance and "hope" you can get thru it? After seeing many pictures, I've notice some innocent looking puddles that have swallowed half the truck. While I enjoy the obstacles an challenges, I don't ever want to spend the day trying to get unstuck.

I will test the depth. Generally I will avoid most larger puddles. I'm not in the woods to get my Jeep all dirty (gasp!) or to dig ruts. It's to explore. If I have to go through a puddle to get to where I am going, and I am reasonably sure that the puddle won't get me stuck, I'll go through it.

 

[BEHR655]

What Ben said.
I'll get out and test the depth of the puddle with a stick also checking for firmness of the road below it. After you spend more time in the Pines you will get to know which puddles are OK to go through and which to avoid.

Why Ben bought that Rubicon, I have no idea.

Steve

 

[kingofthepines]

I often travel alone and encounter many water obstacles of unknown depth. Its important to remember that the puddle you crossed with ease last week may have since been rutted deeply by yahoos who stop in the middle and power brake in 2wd simply for the photo op. My submarine days are long over for a variety of reasons but I still go out when I can. My basic approach is to enter the hole slowly always on the left side of the hole so that if I were to get stuck I can open the door and exit on dry land or maybe just a few inches of water. I'll gladly sacrifice a scratch or two down the side to avoid having to replace a $2800 swamped transmission. Never enter a hole right down the middle. You can be guaranteed that is where the deepest ruts are. Without a spotter there are a few tricks to gauge the depth of the water from the drivers seat. I'll turn off the tunes and roll down the window. I know on my grand cherokee the exhaust (head pipe) is at the level of the bottom of the doors. If I hear the pipe sizzle from contact with water I'll know that its time to make a decision. Where I am in the hole will often be the deciding factor. Generally, though not always, once you are past the half way point you're about to start climbing out anyway so I just go for it. Don't forget to be in 4wd before you enter the water, not once your in there. A hole on a road/trail that is in the area of deciduous trees has a better chance of having a soft bottom than a hole that is primarily in the area of pines. I'd bet that 90% of the holes you'll encounter are hard bottoms. M/T's have their advantages in certain situations but most stucks are a result of the pumpkins hanging up. Tire size is everything in avoiding stucks but thats another story altogether. You'd be wise to simply avoid areas that you should know are impassable....quarter mile, swamp loop, hell trail etc. Another clue to the depth of the water is the width of the hole. In my experience wide usually means deep. Should you find yourself stuck with water all around avoid the temptation to gun the motor. You run the risk of sucking water into the intake. And that is a disaster you want to avoid. An absolute must are tow hooks to hook a strap to so someone can pull you out. Fishing around in the dark in 22 degree water trying to find a place to hook up a strap is an unnecessary aggravation and just plain stupid. There is lots more I could go into but these are most of the rules I follow when I'm out there whether I'm alone or not. HTH

 

[Ben Ruset]

Why Ben bought that Rubicon, I have no idea.

Yeah. I think about that a lot. Especially when I fill it up at the pump, only to have it be drunk away at the tune of 15MPG due to the tires and gearing.

I've pretty much decided to sell it.

 

[bobpbx]

I often travel alone and encounter many water obstacles of unknown depth. Its important to remember that the puddle you crossed with ease last week may have since been rutted deeply by yahoos who stop in the middle and power brake in 2wd simply for the photo op. My submarine days are long over for a variety of reasons but I still go out when I can. My basic approach is to enter the hole slowly always on the left side of the hole so that if I were to get stuck I can open the door and exit on dry land or maybe just a few inches of water. I'll gladly sacrifice a scratch or two down the side to avoid having to replace a $2800 swamped transmission. Never enter a hole right down the middle. You can be guaranteed that is where the deepest ruts are. Without a spotter there are a few tricks to gauge the depth of the water from the drivers seat. I'll turn off the tunes and roll down the window. I know on my grand cherokee the exhaust (head pipe) is at the level of the bottom of the doors. If I hear the pipe sizzle from contact with water I'll know that its time to make a decision. Where I am in the hole will often be the deciding factor. Generally, though not always, once you are past the half way point you're about to start climbing out anyway so I just go for it. Don't forget to be in 4wd before you enter the water, not once your in there. A hole on a road/trail that is in the area of deciduous trees has a better chance of having a soft bottom than a hole that is primarily in the area of pines. I'd bet that 90% of the holes you'll encounter are hard bottoms. M/T's have their advantages in certain situations but most stucks are a result of the pumpkins hanging up. Tire size is everything in avoiding stucks but thats another story altogether. You'd be wise to simply avoid areas that you should know are impassable....quarter mile, swamp loop, hell trail etc. Another clue to the depth of the water is the width of the hole. In my experience wide usually means deep. Should you find yourself stuck with water all around avoid the temptation to gun the motor. You run the risk of sucking water into the intake. And that is a disaster you want to avoid. An absolute must are tow hooks to hook a strap to so someone can pull you out. Fishing around in the dark in 22 degree water trying to find a place to hook up a strap is an unnecessary aggravation and just plain stupid. There is lots more I could go into but these are most of the rules I follow when I'm out there whether I'm alone or not. HTH

Good advice King. All right on the money. Now, if you're Jeff, you plow right in for the hell of it, then hike out 7-8 miles for the hell of it.

 

[LARGO]

Yeah. I think about that a lot.
I've pretty much decided to sell it.

Buy a Quad, you'll love it.

 

[woodjin]

Good advice King. All right on the money. Now, if you're Jeff, you plow right in for the hell of it, then hike out 7-8 miles for the hell of it.

Actually, I did everything KOP recommends. I've gone through so many mud holes. I sometimes test depth and bottom while wearing my waders. I always "straddle" the ruts. In this last situation, I was already 1/2 way out of the hole (to the 0ther side) when my rear end slipped into the ruts and my rear axle touched...holding my rear wheels above the bottom of the hole. My front couldn't get enough bite after that. Even though my front end was almost out.

The mud holes can be very deceptive. Clearly some one was stuck in this hole before and rutted it something awful. Since that time the mud settled and hid the disturbance. It looked identicle to the 7 or 8 mud holes before it where I didn't even spin a tire. I have ridden motorcycles through many also, which poses a whole new set of concerns.

Interestingly, I never go out with the intent of 4 wheeling. I just want to get somewhere and these obsticles get in the way.

Jeff

 

[Badfish740]

Another concern I've found is that you never know what some idiot may have dumped there (either intentionally or it was just a low spot which is now covered with water) not to mention what others piled in there when they got stuck. How do I know? Once I was doing what any dumb 17 year old with a beat up Land Cruiser would do in the Assunpink WMA-looking for mudholes to drive through and patting himself on the back after getting to the other side. I took a stick and measured the ruts on the right side of one hole, but not the left. I moved through at about 20 mph (the hole was about 30 feet long) and BANG! I hit a huge pile of crap that turned out to be chunks of concrete in the left rut. Didn't do any damage, but gave me a hell of a jolt (and a scare) and made me lose my momentum so I had to get yanked out.

A while later in Wharton I was who knows where when I attempted a similar hole (this time measuring both sides of course) to the one at the WMA. Nothing like being in the middle of a small body of water and hearing psssssssssshhhhhhhh burble burble burble... The culprit? A jagged piece of angle iron about 3 feet long buried in the mud.

The moral of the story is, either get sonar, or go around

 

[this_is_nascar]

Thanks for all the tips folks. There's a bunch of information that I'll be able to learn from.

 

[woodjin]

Another concern I've found is that you never know what some idiot may have dumped there (either intentionally or it was just a low spot which is now covered with water) not to mention what others piled in there when they got stuck. How do I know? Once I was doing what any dumb 17 year old with a beat up Land Cruiser would do in the Assunpink WMA-looking for mudholes to drive through and patting himself on the back after getting to the other side. I took a stick and measured the ruts on the right side of one hole, but not the left. I moved through at about 20 mph (the hole was about 30 feet long) and BANG! I hit a huge pile of crap that turned out to be chunks of concrete in the left rut. Didn't do any damage, but gave me a hell of a jolt (and a scare) and made me lose my momentum so I had to get yanked out.

A while later in Wharton I was who knows where when I attempted a similar hole (this time measuring both sides of course) to the one at the WMA. Nothing like being in the middle of a small body of water and hearing psssssssssshhhhhhhh burble burble burble... The culprit? A jagged piece of angle iron about 3 feet long buried in the mud.

The moral of the story is, either get sonar, or go around

That was always my biggest concern with riding motorcycles through a mud hole; what was underneath the water. a log that would only help a 4x4 could throw a bike down quick!!

Jeff

 

[this_is_nascar]

It's a shame that people have to be like that. I guess no activity/sport is without its troublemakers. Like I said, we go out for the adventure and to see the beauty, not to tear the crap out of an area. I view the mudholes as something that may pop-up from time to time, not as a "mission" to seek them out and attempt to conquer them. When I do encounter them, I decide if/how to proceed. Assuming there's no way around them, I must then decide to proceed with caution or turn around and go back the way I came. Being able to get thru them safely is what prompted my post.

 

[wis bang]

Problem is putting stuff into a mud hole can get you moving but it usually results in immediate abandonment of what ever was just stuck under the jack/ wheels...of course mud coated stuff is not easy to retrieve either!

 

[Sky042]

I've done a lot by myself and at least once I SHOULD have gotten stuck(big puddle near calico) but I had enough momentum and really narly tires to keep me going. Othertimes I've been very adverterous I've had two trucks.
The first time I ever tried the road out from Marthas Furnace to chatsworth road (LOTS of very long puddles) it was with two vehicles.

I used to have a 97 4x4 S-10 blazer with 31" tires and I really didn't care about the paint I got through a LOT of stuff in that truck.

Now I have an 04 ZR-2 and I've barely taken it anywhere I used to go partially because my off-road buddy's truck died and I'm afraid of scratching the new truck as much as the old one.

I'm actually planning on going out this wed or thursday to do some photography work with a buddy of mine and I'll tell you that despite my ZR-2 being FAR more capable than my old blazer I don't think I'll tackle anywhere near the level of off-road stuff I did before.

Best advice in this thread is go with 2 vehicles. and a pair of FRS radios makes it more fun. what we'd do is when heading into what looked like a really bad stretch of water is we'd hook the tow strap to the hitch on the back of the first vehicle and then route it into the rear cargo area and lay it there attached to the vehicle. So that if the first truck got stuck he could simply crawl into the back of his truck open the rear glass and toss the strap to me waiting at the edge of the puddle to hook to my front tow hook.

This method worked best as it kept the driver of the first vehicle from getting wet!.