New Frog Popping Up In New Places in Jersey
- Thread starter Teegate
- Start date
From the article:
"So, over the course of the two years since then, the team has been researching the physical elements that make this particular frog different from every other species."
For the herpers on the forum, are these physical elements something that stand out and are noticeable to the non-herpers (i.e, would I have trouble determining this species if I found one by just examining it)?
"So, over the course of the two years since then, the team has been researching the physical elements that make this particular frog different from every other species."
For the herpers on the forum, are these physical elements something that stand out and are noticeable to the non-herpers (i.e, would I have trouble determining this species if I found one by just examining it)?
Blacks and whites look different but are regarded as the same species. French and English folks sound quite different but are as also the Same species .What makes these frogs so different?I guess frogs Don"t h a 've to deal with accusations of racism.other
The one in the barrens has a more narrow snout and longer. It's also more slender and much more attractive. The new species is more wide and duller looking. If you see the two together they look different. For years most have always referred to has the barrens ones as a pretty leopard frog.
Thanks. Where I go I see many frogs...I'll start taking photos of them.
I'd be flamed right off the map by the "academic" herpers for saying this, but it sounds to me like a Southern leopard frog mimicking a wood frog.
Compare the call of the new leopard frog species...
...to the wood frog:
Compare the call of the new leopard frog species...
...to the wood frog:
okay I can hear the recordings now.I hear leopards making calls like this around here all the time.I have often mistaken them for wood frogs.I know a brackish pond in Dix where there are hundreds of frogs clucking like this every spring.I thought that was how a leopard frog was supposed to sound.I know some leopards make more of a laughing/chuckling sound but have never noticed or paid attention if it had anything to do with geographic location.I assumed it was either a temperature thing or a local accent such as goes on with birds....and I still do.No new species here,just one says you'uns and another says y'all.The northern grey and southern grey (copes) are easily distinguishable by call but it's really the same call the Copes just trills much faster so sounds more like a buzz.I have even heard them together in the same place,much like snowbirds in Florida,you can tell their not local but their still folks.
Al, I would guess all the ones by you are this new type. Interesting thing would be to go to the cool secret pbtf spot I gave you and whip a few years back (I don't want to publicly mention the locale or hints). Now those frogs should be the atlantic/new one, however i recall seeing some there and they looked like the true southern leopard i see in the core barrens. The one with the slender build and sharper nose (they sort look like pineys, hah).
Would be interesting to see if you could get two separate calls. I've always thought the cold thing too, like sorta a half committed call. I don't think I've ever actually heard the 'southern leopard' call that I hear on some youtube videos, but i've only been out in woods along the coast and periphery barrens during calling season.
Would be interesting to see if you could get two separate calls. I've always thought the cold thing too, like sorta a half committed call. I don't think I've ever actually heard the 'southern leopard' call that I hear on some youtube videos, but i've only been out in woods along the coast and periphery barrens during calling season.
I've heard them calling and I have heard the chuckles and grunts that are the 'textbook' Southern leopard frog call in the pines. I've never heard the new leopard frog call in the barrens, although truth be told it sounds like the same 'voice' singing a slightly different song. I am not sure that I would notice the difference if I were not looking for it.
I have been trying to find a chorus of Wood Frogs for Whip to record for years and every time I think I"ve located one it turns out on closer investigation to be Leopards,I"ve located several good places for Green Treefrogs.Still looking for a Pickerel spot.I don't think they liken Cumberland county
Pickerel frogs are supposed to range statewide, but I have never found them on outer coastal plains soils. In Burlington County I have found them on the inner coastal plain, but not the outer. Here in Mercer County, and North, the juveniles like to overwinter in springs. I've never seen the adults in winter. Pickerel frogs will call from underwater, and their calls are a low-frequency 'snoring' sound.
For wood frogs, if there is doubt as to what you are hearing, I would say that looking at the time of year helps. Wood frogs will be the first calling, along with peepers and other chorus frogs. If you are hearing them on the first warm rains in March, they are wood frogs. You will also hear wood frogs calling during the day during the breeding season. They are explosive breeders, so their season is short.
I have reliable spots to record both species. You and Whip just say the word and we're there.
leopards start pretty early around here as well.I see wood frogs occasionally one at a time.Never seen a breeding mass.Never actually seen one call.Everytime I think I'm on the trail of a Wood it ends up being a leopard.
I've only seen a few pickerels in southern nj. The spot I would find them out is a series of vernal pools at the new virtual hospital (a really herp loaded spot,ashame). Pickerels are probably all over Salem county and Gloucester but I've never searched or heard them there. Pretty sure the closest I've heard wood frogs to you Al is over by buck road (not that close). I don't know why but wood frogs in SJ are very sporadic popping up in one area then absent, makes no sense. I've seen them in barrens habitat in mays landing but absent completely a mile away. They are all over Salem and I once found one randomly In a swamp while tracking a timber in the core barrens, who the heck knows. The same oddness occurs with red spotted newts. Common as dirt everywhere up north but sporadic at best in SJ.
Dragon that is interesting that you found a red-spotted newt in South Jersey. I have read that in harsh, acidic or dryer conditions that they will skip the intermediate 'eft' stage and remain aquatic for the duration of their lives. Did you find one in the eft stage or was it aquatic?
I remember being in Stokes State forest maybe ten years ago along a ravine trail (starts with a T but can't remember the name).There was a fast stream dropping over slide after slide and it was drizzling off and on.lots of green moss and dark grey rock.I looked around and noticed a eft,then another and within a quarter mile of trail I seen over 100 efts all walking along as if they had someplace to go.These little dudes are one of my favorite salamanders.I have never encountered one in the barrens and only sporadically in WV.Once I did encounter a Northern Rd in the Plains branch cedar swamp.A friend of mine was in front of me in a really nasty section of logged out cedar swamp.The hidden slash under the mud made waking treacherus and everything was covered in sphagnum.His foot came down and a Red squirted out from under it,I dove for it but it was too fast.It skittered across six feet of sphagnum and dove beck under.Only one I"ve ever seen here though i have run into them in caves in WV as well as Cave salamanders which are similar.
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I found it in the adult form in spot off buck road. As a kid I found them in some woodlands in Barrington but too polluted now. There is also quite a few records off 530 in whiting in core barrens. Herp associates caught them in pitfall traps. Red sals are common in barrens in cedar swamps. However you occasionally find them upland which is totally bizarre.
Also I totally forget I have wood frogs in my yard in shamong/Medford. I really have no idea where they came from or what they like in my yard. The closest wetland is about around the west jersey cranberry bogs which I don't think would support them. Weird place this south jersey is.
Wood frogs are definitely more of an 'upland' frog than the other Ranids in NJ. Beside their breeding time in the vernals, I only see them away from water and typically find them under leaf litter or under logs. You must have a vernal pool nearby. Ever hear them in the spring? Also, have you ever found any that were frozen? I know of one or two instances where they were found frozen in leaf litter or under logs.
Red sals are a funny thing, I've found them in seepage areas in winter, streams in mid-spring, then they disappear altogether. I do reliably find the juveniles though. Never found a red in the barrens. If I ever found a red salamander in the barrens I'd definitely be looking closely at its eyes
Red sals are a funny thing, I've found them in seepage areas in winter, streams in mid-spring, then they disappear altogether. I do reliably find the juveniles though. Never found a red in the barrens. If I ever found a red salamander in the barrens I'd definitely be looking closely at its eyes