Road Closures

Teegate

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I am starting this thread to get road closure locations. If you see a road in Wharton with a plastic sign saying "No Motor Vehicles" take a GPS coordinate and post it here. I will start a map and add them to it and post it as I get a few and they come in.

Especially at:

Carranza Road
Hampton Road
Route 532


I haven't spent much time in these area's lately and I am hearing more and more roads are closing. Let's get a better handle on them. If you don't want to post them you can email them to me or send a private message. My email is on all of my photos.
 

MuckSavage

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Apr 1, 2005
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I don't know if this is the right spot to post, but Saturday, a friend pulled into the Atsion Ranger Station parking lot, around 8 pm to make a phone call. From the back of the lot (area of the composting toilet)an NJSPP officer drives up to him with all flashing lights on. Approaches my friend on foot & says "parks closed at dusk, no trespassing"
 

Broke Jeep Joe

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Mar 8, 2006
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I don't know if this is the right spot to post, but Saturday, a friend pulled into the Atsion Ranger Station parking lot, around 8 pm to make a phone call. From the back of the lot (area of the composting toilet)an NJSPP officer drives up to him with all flashing lights on. Approaches my friend on foot & says "parks closed at dusk, no trespassing"
I went through this with some folks at Batsto in 2010, and unless it has recently changed, the "Parks" are closed, such as Batsto Village, Atsion Lake, etc. However, the "forest" as a whole and unimproved roads are open 24/7 unless dictated by you know who.....
 

Teegate

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You would think that at least parking in the parking area would be acceptable.
 

lj762

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Feb 18, 2017
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Bass River State Forest
I went through this with some folks at Batsto in 2010, and unless it has recently changed, the "Parks" are closed, such as Batsto Village, Atsion Lake, etc. However, the "forest" as a whole and unimproved roads are open 24/7 unless dictated by you know who.....
Not the way I read it. "Park" here refers to everything, and it is open sunrise to sunset. Except hunters get an extra half hour before and after. Some places have a "Day Use Area" with might be 8am to 8pm, or 8am to dusk. Of course campgrounds are 24/7 but only for permit holders. Enforcement varies, as you know. But if park police tells you the area is closed, (a) they are probably right, and (b) best to just say OK didn't know bye.
 

Broke Jeep Joe

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Mar 8, 2006
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Waterford Twp
Agree to disagree. What are you reading? care to share? There is a huge difference between a "park" and "forest" as we are discussing it here. Do the regular NJSF rules and regs. state the entire forest is closed dusk til dawn? asking because I don't know at the moment. Plus, not that it makes it right or legal but I have been out at night many times and know many people who do the same. I have stopped and talked to the SPP at night and not been bothered.
 
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old jersey girl

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Agree to disagree. What are you reading? care to share? There is a huge difference between a "park" and "forest" as we are discussing it here. Do the regular NJSF rules and regs. state the entire forest is closed dusk til dawn? asking because I don't know at the moment. Plus, not that it makes it right or legal but I have been out at night many times and know many people who do the same. I have stopped and talked to the SPP at night and not been bothered.
You wanna hear owls, need to go at night.
 
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lj762

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Feb 18, 2017
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Bass River State Forest
Yes, "Park", "Forest", and "Recreation Area" have specific meanings when designating State Park Service controlled land. Double Trouble is a State Park, Wharton is a State Forest. But in casual use they tend to use 'park' everywhere. For example, "Park Advisories" contains (seriously out of date) advisories for Forests, Parks, and Recreation Areas. And on a state forest website such as Wharton State Forest you can find text like "Park hours" - open daily sunrise to sunset.

But I will ask and try to confirm this next chance I get.

Campgrounds, as I said, are 24/7 but only for permit holders - these are the people who paid for the campsite. Visitors to campsites have to be out by 8pm I think.

Yes there are night hikes. They ask for and get permission. I don't think they need to go through the whole Special Use Permit thing, though. One night-hike leader I know says she just gets a verbal OK and notifies State Park Police that they will be out there.
 
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Boyd

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Yes, "Park", "Forest", and "Recreation Area" have specific meanings when designating State Park Service controlled land.
The rules here say they can all be called "State Parks"... (?)

"State Park" means all State owned or leased lands, waters and facilities administered by the State Park Service including but not limited to, parks, forests, recreational areas, natural areas, marinas, golf courses, botanical gardens, and historic sites, but not including wildlife management areas or reservoir lands.

 

Broke Jeep Joe

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Mar 8, 2006
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Waterford Twp
Yes, "Park", "Forest", and "Recreation Area" have specific meanings when designating State Park Service controlled land. Double Trouble is a State Park, Wharton is a State Forest. But in casual use they tend to use 'park' everywhere. For example, "Park Advisories" contains (seriously out of date) advisories for Forests, Parks, and Recreation Areas. And on a state forest website such as Wharton State Forest you can find text like "Park hours" - open daily sunrise to sunset.

But I will ask and try to confirm this next chance I get.

Campgrounds, as I said, are 24/7 but only for permit holders - these are the people who paid for the campsite. Visitors to campsites have to be out by 8pm I think.

Yes there are night hikes. They ask for and get permission. I don't think they need to go through the whole Special Use Permit thing, though. One night-hike leader I know says she just gets a verbal OK and notifies State Park Police that they will be out there.
So you are saying that for the last 50 years or so I have been breaking the law along with countless others by being on state forest property at night, have seen multiple branches of LEO and have never been issued a summons and have never been asked more than "where you heading" by the officers. I have to believe there is a difference in the rules and regs. between the parks, rec areas and the entire forest, and you still haven't shared where you are getting your information from? but who knows, the way things are heading pretty soon the whole deal will be a snow globe look but don't touch area.


I did find the following from the state park service code, so we would need to determine what the meaning of "State Park Service area" is to determine if the entire forest is indeed closed when the street lights come on. There is no dusk til dawn clause on the rules and regs stapled to the trees out there are far as I know, can someone confirm? As far as I am concerned the dusk til dawn rule is for the visitor centers and rec areas.

N.J.A.C. 7:2
STATE PARK SERVICE CODE

"State Park" means all State owned or leased lands, waters and facilities administered by
the State Park Service including but not limited to, parks, forests, recreational areas, natural
areas, marinas, golf courses, botanical gardens, and historic sites, but not including wildlife

management areas or reservoir lands.

And this
A person shall not enter or remain in any State Park Service area between the
daily closing and opening time as posted except for authorized activities, which include, but are
not limited to, authorized fish, game, and wildlife activities such as hunting, fishing, and

trapping.

Here is your camping info:
Visitors are allowed in the camping facilities between the hours of 8:00 A.M. and
8:00 P.M. All visitors shall pay the day user parking fee when applicable pursuant to N.J.A.C.
7:2-17.1. The total number of people at a camping facility, including campers and visitors, shall
not exceed six, except at group campsites and primitive campsites
A visitor shall not be allowed in a camping facility between the hours of 8:00
P.M. and 8:00 A.M.


This is interesting and contradictory to the camping rule
Only berth permittees and their guests are permitted marina access between the
hours of 10:00 P.M. and 8:00 A.M.


Specific hours and dates to IBSP
Island Beach State Park shall be closed to all persons, excepting MSFV permit
holders surf fishermen and Barnegat Bay waterfowl hunters between 8:00 P.M. and 8:00 A.M.
from April 1 through October 31 and between 8:00 P.M. and 5:00 A.M. from November 1

through March 31 annually.

Found this interesting for a whole different reason
Commercial Photography $325.00/day plus staff costs
 

lj762

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Feb 18, 2017
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Bass River State Forest
I think I know the guy who put that sign up. Loves his staple hammer, he does indeed.

The sign is a paraphrase or summary. It would take several more trees to hold the entire set of rules.

I'm not clear on what is the legal status of violating Administrative Code (NJAC, vs NJSA) such as the park service code quoted above. Lawyer question. Can you actually be arrested? Probably. It does seem to me that the Park Police have wide discretion and prefer to educate (tell people to stop, or leave, or carry on) rather than strictly enforce. I think that's a good thing, too.

(Maybe this thread needs to go back to reporting road closures.)
 

Teegate

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I have quite a few days during Christmas to start marking them and making a map. By the new year we should have a good idea on where many of them are.