Round 2: Pine Snake vs WalMart

GermanG

Piney
Apr 2, 2005
1,082
392
Little Egg Harbor
They just never seem to get it. You can’t treat wildlife habitat the way you treat a cemetery or historic site. Fencing it off and attempting to stockpile populations does not work with an organism that does not understand boundaries. Add to that the convenience you are handing illegal collectors and you might just as well write the population off.
 

Ben Ruset

Administrator
Site Administrator
Oct 12, 2004
7,552
1,616
Monmouth County
www.benruset.com
All people care about is knocking a few dollars off their property tax bills. Never mind the rampant overdevelopment that characterizes Brick and to a lesser extent Toms River.

It's people like those who support that Wal-Mart that will spell the end of the Pine Barrens as we know it.
 

Spung-Man

Explorer
Jan 5, 2009
941
603
63
Richland, NJ
loki.stockton.edu
Mayor’s Committee for a Green Future, NJ League of Municipalities

According to their website, the Mayor’s Committee for a Green Future (MCGF) “is promoting greening in New Jersey municipalities through education, outreach, leadership and support for municipal programs and practices that protect the environment.”

And who funds this initiative? The MCGF continues, “fourteen New Jersey municipalities were awarded grants of $10,000 and $25,000 through a Wal-Mart donation to help New Jersey municipalities engage in greening and sustainability activities.”



http://www.njslom.org/annual_report.html
 

mudboy dave

Explorer
Oct 15, 2008
950
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atco
opentrailsnj.org
What I think it boils down to alot, is the economy. I myself am not for the building of the walmart. But what I would guess is alot of people are willing to take any kind of discounting or handouts they can get. Theyre are people who are wondering if they will have their house this time next year and hoping they will get their jobs back within that time. For those people who are struggling to that point, I highly doubt they could care about a snake or it's habitat. They are probably more concerned on the tax break and looking at it as a possibility of keeping a roof over their families heads. As far as people supporting Walmart as in shopping there, I still go back to the same point, any savings that people can get, they will just to have that extra dollar to go towards there mortagage or even worse, bankruptcy payment. Please don't take this as I'm supporting Walmart, I just tend to be a little more openminded and can relate were MOST of the pro walmart people are coming from.
 

Boyd

Administrator
Site Administrator
Jul 31, 2004
8,700
2,177
Ben's Branch, Stephen Creek
Good post Mudboy, I am pretty much in agreement with everything you said. I don't think this is a black and white issue, there are many shades of gray.

Regardless of anybody's opinion of WalMart, setting off bombs should not be tolerated. I hope they catch whoever did this and throw the book at them. Somebody could have been killed or maimed with a stunt like that.
 

46er

Piney
Mar 24, 2004
8,837
2,128
Coastal NJ
What I think it boils down to alot, is the economy. I myself am not for the building of the walmart. But what I would guess is alot of people are willing to take any kind of discounting or handouts they can get. Theyre are people who are wondering if they will have their house this time next year and hoping they will get their jobs back within that time. For those people who are struggling to that point, I highly doubt they could care about a snake or it's habitat. They are probably more concerned on the tax break and looking at it as a possibility of keeping a roof over their families heads. As far as people supporting Walmart as in shopping there, I still go back to the same point, any savings that people can get, they will just to have that extra dollar to go towards there mortagage or even worse, bankruptcy payment. Please don't take this as I'm supporting Walmart, I just tend to be a little more openminded and can relate were MOST of the pro walmart people are coming from.

You make goodpoints, but, this is not about putting in a WM where there is none. 2 miles east there is a very large WM thats been there for years. It is all about WM and guvmint greed. I don't see any upside in this particular case except to the principles involved. If there is any tax break, I doubt it would be enough to buy a McDouble.
 

mudboy dave

Explorer
Oct 15, 2008
950
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41
atco
opentrailsnj.org
I agree as far as the bomb goes. I personally use the area theyre talking about for the walmart from time to time for some offroad challanges, and I'll be damned if I want a bomb in any area me or my son go to. As far as the greed goes, someone would have to try to figure out what kind of numbers people would expect to see subtracted from their taxes. If it is a very small amount, I think SOME peoples viewpoint would change. I think most people instantly believe Walmart is a big store, so Big taxes.
 

Spung-Man

Explorer
Jan 5, 2009
941
603
63
Richland, NJ
loki.stockton.edu
They try to make like they're your friend, but really they're an evil empire. :ninja:

I too feel this is a simple matter of greenwash, which is when companies spin their policies as environmentally sound even when they may not be. It might be useful to ask what is NJLM’s vision of “certified sustainable” for the Pinelands National Reserve? In earlier posts, examples of Pinelands “Smart Growth” were provided. A couple of these redevelopment schemes (e.g., Richland Village, ‘Growing Smart into the 21st Century’) are within the domain of the BV Township mayor, who is also NJLM’s 1st Vice President (2009-2010). Buzzwords like “environmentally sustainable,” “best practices,” and “smart future” are repeatedly invoked in reference to Pinelands redevelopment but upon closer scrutiny they may disappoint.

http://www.njslom.org/Green_Future_committee.html
http://www.njslom.org/GreenFuture_committee.html
 

Pine Baron

Explorer
Feb 23, 2008
480
25
Sandy Run
According to the planning board meeting, there is a new Super-Wawa with gas pumps being built at the intersection. These generate tremendous amounts of added traffic. There is only so much civil engineering can do with expanding the existing roads. You make some good points, Mudboy, but will the small tax break you receive, out-way the aggravation you're going to face fighting traffic every day?

ZippySLC had some good comments after the article. :)

John-
 
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