Off Road Woe
- Thread starter james ungehajer
- Start date
That was a completely unbiased article. NOT! I'm glad that article brought up an important point. The new "enhanced" penalties for off- roading. I suppose someday they will pass a law to fine us a million dollars per offense so they can pay for a blue angles squadron to catch offenders. Thankfully the off roading community is trying to counter this legislation by an emailing and letter writing campaign to all state legislators and Governor Corzine.
I guess the SUV set which will never leave the pavement that donates to the PPA will feel like they're saving the pinelands (which they saw on RT539 somewhere on the way to take Ashly to soccer practice).
Tom
I guess the SUV set which will never leave the pavement that donates to the PPA will feel like they're saving the pinelands (which they saw on RT539 somewhere on the way to take Ashly to soccer practice).
Tom
I posted a comment on the website hoping to improve their obviously lacking journalistic credibility:http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/324-11292007-1448533.html
It's about the new proposed penalties. Trying to get people to support this ridiculous new waste of taxpayer money.
Tom
Just so you know, I asked for someone from the NJOHVA to come here and make a few posts about their opinions. So far I have not even received a response to my email.
The ORV community is brain dead. They're fighting a good fight, but it just doesn't seem like their leadership is anywhere near as good as various environmental groups. Maybe that's because the people leading the environmental groups are older? More dedicated? Who knows.
All I do know is that the ORV community doesn't seem to be doing anything but complaining, when what they really need to do is really market themselves better.
The ORV community is brain dead. They're fighting a good fight, but it just doesn't seem like their leadership is anywhere near as good as various environmental groups. Maybe that's because the people leading the environmental groups are older? More dedicated? Who knows.
All I do know is that the ORV community doesn't seem to be doing anything but complaining, when what they really need to do is really market themselves better.
"Several years ago, the state Department of Environmental Protection estimated that up to 300,000 acres of New Jersey land had been damaged by off-road vehicles — and that was before the activity’s popularity skyrocketed."
An area basically three times the size of the Wharton State Forest has been damaged by ORV's. Right, right and I'm the tooth fairy.
An area basically three times the size of the Wharton State Forest has been damaged by ORV's. Right, right and I'm the tooth fairy.
There was a NJOHVA meeting tonight in Metuchen, if sent tonight , it is likely that the message wasnt read yet.
Ben, I'm a member of NJORVA. They try real hard and I'm kind of surprised nobody responded. As far as them having meetings in Metuchen, thats just too far for me. This is just another example as to how far people should want to travel. Am I going to pack up my quads and bikes for a 3 hour drive to Stokes State Forest if a park is placed up there? I sure ain't, I ve got a trail that leads right out of my back yard where I can travel for hours without driving on any paved roads.
As far as the environmental groups, heck yeah, they're well funded non- profit organizations and they recieve alot of taxpayer monies.
I suppose Trailhead only echos the feelings of alot of off roaders. There is no use trying to have any dialog , they merely repeat the same party rhetoric. It's alot easier to just ride and keep to yourself. And that leads to more problems because when you are out riding illegally, you have no friends out there. Even other riders could be enforcement. That means, any time you have visual contact, you have got to make a quick get away.
All of us here know that these groups will not stop with the class II's. It's like Russ said, he respects off roaders right to exist, just not in his forests.
Tom
As far as the environmental groups, heck yeah, they're well funded non- profit organizations and they recieve alot of taxpayer monies.
I suppose Trailhead only echos the feelings of alot of off roaders. There is no use trying to have any dialog , they merely repeat the same party rhetoric. It's alot easier to just ride and keep to yourself. And that leads to more problems because when you are out riding illegally, you have no friends out there. Even other riders could be enforcement. That means, any time you have visual contact, you have got to make a quick get away.
All of us here know that these groups will not stop with the class II's. It's like Russ said, he respects off roaders right to exist, just not in his forests.
Tom
I guess the biggest issue with this point for me is the definition of ORV and "off-roading". Even as we're talking hear, what do folks consider ORV and "off-roading"? Every other weekend in the spring/summer, my wife and I like to pack a lunch, get into the 4x4 truck and ride the dirt roads of the Pine Barrens. We explore, we take pictures, we take walks, we help someone if they happen to be stuck in the road that we're attempting to travel. Do you lump-us in this definition of an "off-roader"?
I hear the terms ORV and "off-roaders" and cringe. I picture those people we all talk about. Those how drive where they're not supposed to, those who drink while driving, those who drive to fast (especially around blind corners), those who purposely rut-up a publically accessible dirt-road for the sake of doing so. I could go on and on....................
I hear the terms ORV and "off-roaders" and cringe. I picture those people we all talk about. Those how drive where they're not supposed to, those who drink while driving, those who drive to fast (especially around blind corners), those who purposely rut-up a publically accessible dirt-road for the sake of doing so. I could go on and on....................
Well, however you want to define offroading, the rule the state cares about is registration. Registered vehicles are allowed, unregistered are not. So all the light-weight ORVs without plates are illegal, which is why they put the rule In place I'd guess.
I have nothing against the guys I run into who are driving responsibly and sticking to the trails. If they want to risk a fine that's their business. Unfortunately most of the ORVs I encounter are being driven at high speed on the roads, often around blind corners, or they are being driven in areas like Old Halfway pit where the state has clearly marked the area as off limits. As long as so many people act that way all of our access is at risk, because it stokes the fires of the enviro elitists who want everything to be a preserve.
I have nothing against the guys I run into who are driving responsibly and sticking to the trails. If they want to risk a fine that's their business. Unfortunately most of the ORVs I encounter are being driven at high speed on the roads, often around blind corners, or they are being driven in areas like Old Halfway pit where the state has clearly marked the area as off limits. As long as so many people act that way all of our access is at risk, because it stokes the fires of the enviro elitists who want everything to be a preserve.
Nope. A properly registered and insured quad or dirt bike is not legal anywhere but that Chatsworth ORV park, or on private property.
Yes, you can buy a quad. Pay the state to register it. And not be able to drive it ANYWHERE in NJ after the Chatsworth park closes.
Yes, you can buy a quad. Pay the state to register it. And not be able to drive it ANYWHERE in NJ after the Chatsworth park closes.
I think you are supposed to register your ATV in New Jersey but why? You can't get a tag for it and you can't ride anywhere unless it is private property with permission or in an off road park. Besides that you are out of luck. If that is the case why bother registering it?
Why buy one in the first place then?
Actually, having insurance for it is very, very smart. It's nice to know that if I was on a quad and caused an accident, I'd be insured. I wouldn't drive a car without insurance, I wouldn't ride a motorcycle without insurance. Why would I drive a quad without insurance?
I wasn't clear enough. It has to be a road-legal vehicle. I don't know what class of registration applies to quads, never having owned one, but as far as I know none of them are street legal. Thing is, I am sure the only reason we are allowed access in road-legal vehicles is the existence of the public rights of way. I suspect that if those didn't exist we'd all be locked out of the woods, other than for foot traffic.
Agreed. Unfortunately, it's those types of folks that you're describing that I always seem to run into (not literally).
I've been watching this thread for a while now and I find it extremely confusing to say the least.
In my 30 years of being in the woods almost every Sunday I seldom if any ever see anyone in the woods.
And over the last 5 years of so even hunters are hard to come by.
I use to remember a lot more users in the old days, but it is rare to ever see anyone in the woods anymore.
Recently, there's been a slew of News Paper stories about ATV use in state forest and riders having no place to ride with the ATV park closing in 2008.
Then in this forum you have proponents for stiffer fines and penalties as well as confiscation.
Then on the other side you have those questioning the rational for this kind of reasoning.
Personally, when I'm in the woods, I'd be hard pressed if I ever come across an ATV in the forest.... maybe a few years ago, but none of as late.
Recently I spent the Sunday riding around the woods with a state park police officer on a really nice Sunday.
We talked a lot about the woods, problems in the woods and different issues, but at no time in that conversation did ATVs ever come up.
We saw hunters that day getting ready for hunting season as well as a few people driving around the forest in there SUVs enjoying the leaves changing colors and a few people running dog sleds, but that was about it.
If illegal ATV use is such problem... then why isn't anyone talking about it other than those that are advocating higher penalties?
Where are these illegal ATV riders and where is the damage they are illegally doing?
igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly:
In my 30 years of being in the woods almost every Sunday I seldom if any ever see anyone in the woods.
And over the last 5 years of so even hunters are hard to come by.
I use to remember a lot more users in the old days, but it is rare to ever see anyone in the woods anymore.
Recently, there's been a slew of News Paper stories about ATV use in state forest and riders having no place to ride with the ATV park closing in 2008.
Then in this forum you have proponents for stiffer fines and penalties as well as confiscation.
Then on the other side you have those questioning the rational for this kind of reasoning.
Personally, when I'm in the woods, I'd be hard pressed if I ever come across an ATV in the forest.... maybe a few years ago, but none of as late.
Recently I spent the Sunday riding around the woods with a state park police officer on a really nice Sunday.
We talked a lot about the woods, problems in the woods and different issues, but at no time in that conversation did ATVs ever come up.
We saw hunters that day getting ready for hunting season as well as a few people driving around the forest in there SUVs enjoying the leaves changing colors and a few people running dog sleds, but that was about it.
If illegal ATV use is such problem... then why isn't anyone talking about it other than those that are advocating higher penalties?
Where are these illegal ATV riders and where is the damage they are illegally doing?
igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly: igfly:
The insurance is a huge issue - a registered vehicle must be insured, so it stands to reason that an unregistered vehicle might not have insurance, no matter how stupid that seems. So what happens? If an uninsured vehicle is involved in an incident/accident, the owner of the property on which the accident occured becomes liable. If the owner of the property, aka The State of NJ, had previously made known that no unregistered vehicles are permitted, they are somewhat protected from liability in a potential civil suit, because they can more-or-less say, "We warned you."