All-Terrain Vehicle Problem

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Broke Jeep Joe

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Mar 8, 2006
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Guess that was my point, wasn't just me that took you as snarky Jon. Guess we all need to throttle back a little here, always happens with this type of debate, that's usually why there is no progress
 

Jon Holcombe

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Guess that was my point, wasn't just me that took you as snarky Jon. Guess we all need to throttle back a little here, always happens with this type of debate, that's usually why there is no progress
Took you wrong about what? Did you think I was calling Bob out to beat the shit out of him? I still have no idea what you are talking about.
 

bobpbx

Piney
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Oct 25, 2002
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I guess you can ignore the facts that don't support your position. Of course there are no poorly supervised young men in the woods.
The facts you cited which happened at your suburban home have nothing to do with the claims Jason made about the Chatsworth ATV park. That's what I'm saying Jon.
 

Jon Holcombe

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Jon, I'm sorry that poorly supervised young man ruined your new system, but that act has no bearing on this discussion.
The facts you cited which happened at your suburban home have nothing to do with the claims Jason made about the Chatsworth ATV park. That's what I'm saying Jon.
I asked you if there are poorly supervised young men in the woods. Because that is the EXACT point of this discussion. Answer the question.
 

Jon Holcombe

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Okay everyone. Let’s calm down.
I will calm down as soon as Bob answers the question.

Are there poorly supervised young men in the woods? He said it, not me, and that is the point of this discussion.

I suppose if a forum moderator makes my point for me, you have the option of banning me, or sending this to slag heap.

But it seems pretty lame for the question to go answered. It is a simple question.
 

bobpbx

Piney
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Oct 25, 2002
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Jon, I've been kind and understanding with you this morning, but your question is rather silly. But I'll answer it; Yes, mixed within the well-behaved, conscientious kids out in the woods, there are usually some poorly supervised kids. There, now you can use it to build the rest of your argument.
 

Jon Holcombe

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Dec 1, 2015
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Jon, I've been kind and understanding with you this morning, but your question is rather silly. But I'll answer it; Yes, mixed within the well-behaved, conscientious kids out in the woods, there are usually some poorly supervised kids. There, now you can use it to build the rest of your argument.
I really don't have any interest in making an argument with someone who isn't capable of doing so in good faith. But I WOULD like to thank you for your kindness and understanding. Really. Thank you Bob.
 
Apr 6, 2004
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I really don't have any interest in making an argument with someone who isn't capable of doing so in good faith. But I WOULD like to thank you for your kindness and understanding. Really. Thank you Bob.
I was interested in hearing your argument, Jon. I think a productive discussion can be had here.
 

Jon Holcombe

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I was interested in hearing your argument, Jon. I think a productive discussion can be had here.
I think my original post made the point clearly. Someone in a motorized vehicle drove up my 100 ft driveway in a suburban neighborhood with houses up and down the street, drove into my backyard leaving ruts in the newly graded dirt and running over a septic port. And did it twice.

Why would anyone think that unsupervised young men or old men on ATV's aren't going to do the same thing under cover of the forest?

If someone is stupid enough to buy an ATV and drive it into the forest, or Gravelly Run, or anywhere else in the state there are problems with ATV's, how is an ATV park going to improve the situation?

In fact, why would someone buy an ATV unless they know where they are going to ride it?

That is a rhetorical question. My friends son rode his ATV with his buddy who also had an ATV illegally in the power line cut behind our development.

There IS no place around here to ride it, but they bought it anyway and I am guessing that is the case with many if not most ATV riders.

The answer is simple: don't buy an ATV.
 
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Broke Jeep Joe

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Jon you seem a little sensitive here, I'm going to throw this out there. Just because there is no place in NJ to ride an ATV on public land doesn't meant folks shouldn't buy them. If they buy them with the knowledge that riding them in this state is illegal except on private land, then so be it, they can use them elsewhere, PA perhaps, or as a maintenance vehicle on their property, or perhaps even a law enforcement or rescue vehicle. I know there is a comeback that says they don't stay on private lands and do what they want here, and that is evident by this discussion. There are many things that are sold and purchased in NJ that can't be used outside of one's privacy but that doesn't stop the consumer, be it hailed as freedom by some or ignorance by others, or possibly an informed consumer that actually does use a product where it is legal. I am sorry for the personal attack on your property and I understand why you are pissed off, not a cheap investment at all, but why the rant? If it were me, I'd ask myself why did this happen? any other homes damaged by the biker? and go from there.
 
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Jon Holcombe

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Dec 1, 2015
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Jon you seem a little sensitive here, I'm going to throw this out there. Just because there is no place in NJ to ride an ATV on public land doesn't meant folks shouldn't buy them. If they buy them with the knowledge that riding them in this state is illegal except on private land, then so be it, they can use them elsewhere, PA perhaps, or as a maintenance vehicle on their property, or perhaps even a law enforcement or rescue vehicle. I know there is a comeback that says they don't stay on private lands and do what they want here, and that is evident by this discussion. There are many things that are sold and purchased in NJ that can't be used outside of one's privacy but that doesn't stop the consumer, be it hailed as freedom by some or ignorance by others, or possibly an informed consumer that actually does use a product where it is legal. I am sorry for the personal attack on your property and I understand why you are pissed off, not a cheap investment at all, but why the rant? If it were me, I'd ask myself why did this happen? any other homes damaged by the biker? and go from there.
I am sick of the horsecrap rationalizations here. Personal freedom my ass. People buy ATV's to ride into the forest. Why? Because they are sold by the moneyed interests and dealerships and the state looks the other way (and profits from it).

Building a ATV park to stop illegal ATV use is absurd. It will encourage more people to buy ATV's and that means more people will ride them illegally. Look at Gravelly Run.

A similar nonsensical argument is used by the NRA. More guns means a safer America.

I've said my piece, I am not changing anyone's mind on the site, so talk among yourselves.
 
Apr 6, 2004
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I've said my piece, I am not changing anyone's mind on the site, so talk among yourselves.
Perhaps you have a really good handle on everyone here, but I'd say that the safer bet is that you are merely projecting.

I agree that a dedicated park wouldn't solve the problem. I can see why it could help, but I can also see why it might also possibly hurt for the reason you stated.
 
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