Are these snakes in pines?

suresue592003

Explorer
Apr 4, 2004
372
1
Browns Mills, NJ
Someone was telling me the other day that there is a snake in the pines called a puffed adder or bull snake. They said the adder swells up when it gets disturbed. Does anyone know anything about these snakes?
Thanks for info.
 

suresue592003

Explorer
Apr 4, 2004
372
1
Browns Mills, NJ
Sue, that is the hognosed snake. It does puff up and hiss at you like an adder. If that does not work, it rolls over belly side up and plays dead. They are harmless but scary. Here is a photo of one puffing up a bit:

http://images.google.com/imgres?img...0&prev=/images?q=hognose&gbv=2&svnum=10&hl=en

Thank you so much, you were a big help. No I have never seen one, but it sure is ugly. I don't care for snakes, therefore I wouldn't want to run across one. The one I was told about was apparently hanging in a wild huckleberry bush.
 

dragoncjo

Piney
Aug 12, 2005
1,530
242
42
camden county
Trust me snakes don't care for us either. Sounds like a hognose completely harmless and a species of concern in nj, what county was the snake seen in?
 

piker56

Explorer
Jan 13, 2006
640
53
67
Winslow
Thank you so much, you were a big help. No I have never seen one, but it sure is ugly. I don't care for snakes, therefore I wouldn't want to run across one. The one I was told about was apparently hanging in a wild huckleberry bush.

My wife found one under a blueberry bush while we were picking a couple years ago, it just about made her faint when it hissed and puffed up. Then it rolled over and we could pick it up. When we tried to turn it over it kept going belly up again.
 

ChrisNJ

Explorer
Jan 31, 2006
149
0
Medford
"Then it rolled over and we could pick it up. When we tried to turn it over it kept going belly up again."

Thats awesome, and to think some people are afraid of them.
 

dragoncjo

Piney
Aug 12, 2005
1,530
242
42
camden county
The are a species of concern because their numbers are suspected to be diminishing. Their main food source is the fowler's toad, also a species of concern, subsequently if one is declining the other will also. Fowler's toads and all amphibians are on the decline due to pollutants and acid rain.
 

Bobbleton

Explorer
Mar 12, 2004
466
46
NJ
y'know a pinesnake is also suspect. "pinesnake" and "bullsnake" are sometimes used interchangeably and they have no qualms about hissing loudly when disturbed.

one thing . . . any NJ snake species capable of producing a loud hiss isn't going to be hanging in a bush or anywhere off the ground for that matter. they're fossorial if anything and even if they tried i doubt either of those heavy species would even be capable of climbing anything - let alone be held up by the flimsy little twigs of a huckleberry bush.

i find it a good rule to take any snake tale with a huge grain of salt. if not I'd still be looking for those prolific "water moccasins" in NJ - you know - the poisonous ones that chase you and bite at your feet if you aren't fast enough to kill them first . . . .
 

suresue592003

Explorer
Apr 4, 2004
372
1
Browns Mills, NJ
y'know a pinesnake is also suspect. "pinesnake" and "bullsnake" are sometimes used interchangeably and they have no qualms about hissing loudly when disturbed.

one thing . . . any NJ snake species capable of producing a loud hiss isn't going to be hanging in a bush or anywhere off the ground for that matter. they're fossorial if anything and even if they tried i doubt either of those heavy species would even be capable of climbing anything - let alone be held up by the flimsy little twigs of a huckleberry bush.

i find it a good rule to take any snake tale with a huge grain of salt. if not I'd still be looking for those prolific "water moccasins" in NJ - you know - the poisonous ones that chase you and bite at your feet if you aren't fast enough to kill them first . . . .

I beg to differ, and take offense that you would imply that what I am saying is a "tale". My sources are reliable. I do not have the time for pointless tales. There are different species that will climb up in bushes for prey if they are hungry enough. Afterall birds do nest in bushes and a species may go off it's normal diet if what they normally eat cannot be found. Back in the early 60s alot of vegetation had grown thick and unfarmed. Also, I never specified the size of the snake.
I remember seeing with my own eyes a snake that had curled around a straight pole which sat a purple martin house. This pole was high enough that my father had to shoot the snake in order to save the birds.
 

dragoncjo

Piney
Aug 12, 2005
1,530
242
42
camden county
You are correct rat snakes will climb trees to eat both birds and their eggs. However, both pine snakes and hognose snakes do not climb as a rule. Small shrubry is a possibility but def. not the norm. Pine snakes are big clumsy slow snakes so climbing is a tough task. I will let bob speak for himself but your original post sounded as if it was just something that passed in conversation. I trust your source was reliable, but there is a massive amount of myth's about snakes of new jersey and snakes in general. Please by all means don't hurt them they may be ugly to some but you are at greater risk of being attacked by a squirrel then a snake.
 

Bobbleton

Explorer
Mar 12, 2004
466
46
NJ
this is certainly not a shot at you. I was of the understanding that this was a story told to you - one you did not yourself experience. i recognize that there are plenty of snakes who climb, ratsnakes, racers and corns are all excellent climbers. green snakes, garters, ribbons and even some water snakes are adept in the branches. but as far as climbers go, hogs and pits are probably the worst climbers (even after rattlesnakes) and the loudest hissers by ALOT. they're also the only ones with nicknames like puff adder or bullsnake.

even if your source is a naturalist, unless he/she is an expert or a member of the herping culture - if that person forgot the name its also possible they misidentified the snake. my mentor has a phd in (pine-barrens based) ecology and my modest herp identification skills dwarf his own.

this is in no way an attack at you or your source, its simply my reflecting on my experience of almost EVERY story involving a snake having exaggeration or misidentification of some sort. i also recognize that this often reflects poorly on snakes in general and eventually results in much senseless killing of snakes. in this sense i always try to bring up this point in an effort to battle the overwhelming bad rumors present about these animals. ones that result on harmless snakes being shot instead of relocated.
 

suresue592003

Explorer
Apr 4, 2004
372
1
Browns Mills, NJ
Many "PHD"s learn from books. I learned from being there. There are alot of misconception where pineys are concerned as well. The man who told me the story of the snake wasn't some bar drunk. It was my sober uncle who is 60 yr old and visited Friendship when he was 18. He discribed the snake perfectly. He told me so much that day that I compared it with my other uncle, what I remembered and what my parents had told me. It all panned out.
Years ago pineys often killed snakes, especially rattlers. They collected the rattles like some hunters collect antlers, their trophies. Plus they feared the rattler. Recently I was visiteing Chatsworth Municipal Building looking at the photos. A man approached me and asked if I ever seen the photos in the court room. I said "No, I didn't know there were any in the court room." He was kind enouth to open the door and let me view the photos. One photo showed a man holding a snake. The gentleman who let me in proceeded to tell me a story regarding rattlers. The last thing he said was, "I don't care what anybody says, I'll kill them every chance I get." He had known my family and was a true piney. Some of the old ways never die.
 

bobpbx

Piney
Staff member
Oct 25, 2002
14,218
4,319
Pines; Bamber area
The man who told me the story of the snake wasn't some bar drunk.

Sue, I think Bobbleton is being very fair with you. He is not attacking your integrity. If you read his post again, he is actually being respectful. He had no way of knowing it was your uncle who gave you the information. Even so, I don't think he thought you were talking to a bar drunk either.
 

dragoncjo

Piney
Aug 12, 2005
1,530
242
42
camden county
ok, I thought maybe from you post that you would harm them. I understand your view though, and I'm not going to touch the whole God element of it.

SureSue, not sure why you originally posted your inquiry, it seems you know much about snakes already. Also isn't inferring bob's mentor is just book learned the same thing as him questioning your source?
 
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