Fix Our Parks

[TommyP]

The Pinelands Preservation Alliance and the NJ TRail Conference among others have banded together for a “Fix Our Parks” campaign to urge the state to address the parks project backlog, to promote eco and historical tourism, and to properly staff the departments.
I’m a writer and I offered to write an op-ed that could be used to promote this, but I don‘t want to feed into the locked gates, seasonal and permanent closures, and banning access to responsible people.
I’ve read some of the PPA threads in the past where they tried to impose a road map that declared many roads off-limits, and I don’t want that.

So I’m asking the people who I know love the Pinelands and want it to remain open for responsible use. You all. I have to mention illegal off-roading because it is an issue, but what are the issues and solutions you think need to be addressed, so this doesn’t become a gateway to locking down the Pines to responsible use?

 

[Boyd]

Probably a noble cause, but it doesn't do much for me. I just don't see much that needs "fixing" down South where I hang out, but I hardly ever go to Wharton. One of their top 3 priorities is giving more power to the superintendents.... that might be a can of worms.

A Campaign to Improve NJ's Parks and Public Lands | Fix Our Parks NJ

Mobilizing the public to demand greater resources for New Jersey's state parks, forests and natural areas.

www.fixourparksnj.org

 

[ecampbell]

Probably a noble cause, but it doesn't do much for me. I just don't see much that needs "fixing" down South where I hang out, but I hardly ever go to Wharton. One of their top 3 priorities is giving more power to the superintendents.... that might be a can of worms.

A Campaign to Improve NJ's Parks and Public Lands | Fix Our Parks NJ

Mobilizing the public to demand greater resources for New Jersey's state parks, forests and natural areas.

www.fixourparksnj.org

Probably a noble cause, but it doesn't do much for me. I just don't see much that needs "fixing" down South where I hang out, but I hardly ever go to Wharton. One of their top 3 priorities is giving more power to the superintendents.... that might be a can of worms.

A Campaign to Improve NJ's Parks and Public Lands | Fix Our Parks NJ

Mobilizing the public to demand greater resources for New Jersey's state parks, forests and natural areas.

www.fixourparksnj.org

more power to the superintendents.

That would create a dictator. The current Super of Wharton doesn't want anyone in the forest.

 

[Jon Holcombe]

The Pinelands National Reserve is fairly unique because the poplulation within a few hours drive is probably 35 million people. I had some back and forth on the Fix Our Parks page. Russ Juelg is a fair minded, experienced administrator who has a pretty good handle on the political and practical realities.

Apparently the superintendents take a back seat to the DEP and the Pinelands Commission,. so the politics are going to rule the day.

Every moron with an ATV, the fleets of jeeps who look for challenging driving down legal and illegal roads, with giant tires, winches and snorkels, in state and out of state, have ruined it for the sensible 4 x4 drivers.

It is a shame because the new MAP is coming.

 

[Ben Ruset]

The Pinelands Preservation Alliance and the NJ TRail Conference among others have banded together for a “Fix Our Parks” campaign to urge the state to address the parks project backlog, to promote eco and historical tourism, and to properly staff the departments.
I’m a writer and I offered to write an op-ed that could be used to promote this, but I don‘t want to feed into the locked gates, seasonal and permanent closures, and banning access to responsible people.
I’ve read some of the PPA threads in the past where they tried to impose a road map that declared many roads off-limits, and I don’t want that.

So I’m asking the people who I know love the Pinelands and want it to remain open for responsible use. You all. I have to mention illegal off-roading because it is an issue, but what are the issues and solutions you think need to be addressed, so this doesn’t become a gateway to locking down the Pines to responsible use?

If you want to whip up something for the front page of this site (www.njpinebarrens.com) I'm happy to publish it. The last thing I wrote was in 2017!

 

[Teegate]

It appears they are not mentioning the closing of roads. What their ultimate goal is and will it change from what they say on that website is unknown. What they are saying on that website if pretty much the truth.

 

[TommyP]

When I write the op-ed I will make sure to put in "enforce the rules against illegal off-road vehicles, so roads can remain passable for responsible use" and see if they want me to excise it...

 

[ecampbell]

When I write the op-ed I will make sure to put in "enforce the rules against illegal off-road vehicles, so roads can remain passable for responsible use" and see if they want me to excise it...

Be careful, THEY get to define illegal "off-road vehicles" and "responsible use". Don't trust them.

 

[TommyP]

This is what I got from them:
”For NJCF's and Pinelands Alliance, as well as the organized enduro(ECEA) and other established vehicle groups, our position is shared that the USGS maps (ranging from 1955-1997 in publication) should be the official road maps of the pine barrens.”

 

[Jon Holcombe]

TommyP, if you want to see the strategy, join the "Pine Barrens Land Defense" Facebook group (formerly "Fix Our Parks").

The two admins are Jason Howell and Russ Juelg. They are presenting the issues and their solutions. I believe Jason Howell is prominent in Pinelands Preservation Alliance and Russ Juelg is the administrator to Franklin Parker Preserve. Russ is a very smart and experienced steward for the New Jersey Conservation Foundation.

 

[Boyd]

At best, that's a lazy approach to the issue. As they correctly indicate, those topo maps range from about 25 years to 70 years old and no longer reflect reality on the ground. Have posted about this before, and I'm sure we could find many other examples, but here is one.

Bulldozed Road is on the USGS National Map

https://boydsmaps.com/#16.00/39.733387/-74.654245/usgsTopo/0.00/0.00

OpenStreetMap

https://boydsmaps.com/#16.00/39.732826/-74.653665/mbxtopo/0.00/0.00

Clearly visible on aerial imagery

https://boydsmaps.com/#18.12/39.732854/-74.653489/njgin2020/0.00/0.00

But not on the old 24k topo, so I guess it would be closed

https://boydsmaps.com/#16.00/39.733387/-74.654245/pines1999/0.00/0.00

 

[Boyd]

The two admins are Jason Howell and Russ Juelg.

Jason is a member here but has not visited the site for about 5 years now. You can see his posts here

Jason Howell

forums.njpinebarrens.com

 

[TommyP]

It's an unrealistic solution. Am I supposed to buy USGS maps and keep them with me so I know where I am allowed to drive?

 

[Boyd]

Well, at least boydsmaps has you covered there.

 

[TommyP]

Well, at least boydsmaps has you covered there.

Yeah. I'm starting a new job where I'll have weekends free and more money, so I'm going to work on a setup where I can use your maps more. I was at Carranza memorial for the tribute and had no T-Mobile/Sprint, and only 3G/1x on Verizon... do y'all use AT&T or what?

 

[bobpbx]

At best, that's a lazy approach to the issue. As they correctly indicate, those topo maps range from about 25 years to 70 years old and no longer reflect reality on the ground. Have posted about this before, and I'm sure we could find many other examples, but here is one.

Bulldozed Road is on the USGS National Map

https://boydsmaps.com/#16.00/39.733387/-74.654245/usgsTopo/0.00/0.00

OpenStreetMap

https://boydsmaps.com/#16.00/39.732826/-74.653665/mbxtopo/0.00/0.00

Clearly visible on aerial imagery

https://boydsmaps.com/#18.12/39.732854/-74.653489/njgin2020/0.00/0.00

But not on the old 24k topo, so I guess it would be closed

https://boydsmaps.com/#16.00/39.733387/-74.654245/pines1999/0.00/0.00

That's a nice catch Boyd. But really, we all supported Ben's open letter back in 2016 (snippet below). To me, it's important the members of the forum support that letter and the contents, even if it sacrifices roads under the radar such as that one.

NJPineBarrens.com and Open Trails NJ are taking the position that:

• We support using a USGS Topographical map to establish a baseline of roads, however the 1997 map must be used as it is last complete map of roads in Wharton State Forest.

 

[Ben Ruset]

Yeah. I'm starting a new job where I'll have weekends free and more money, so I'm going to work on a setup where I can use your maps more. I was at Carranza memorial for the tribute and had no T-Mobile/Sprint, and only 3G/1x on Verizon... do y'all use AT&T or what?

I have AT&T and I had mostly no service out in Rockwood yesterday. Every now and then my phone (iPhone 11) would register one bar and I'd get a notification of something but essentially it was a brick.

 

[Ben Ruset]

There's a new Facebook group that's also run by Russ and Jason called NJ Parks and Forests. I joined, but when I saw Jason posting I unfollowed (but did not leave) because I just don't need that stress in my life anymore.

 

[Teegate]

I believe that both Jason and Russ are truly interested in closing roads. I am certain I am in agreement with both of them concerning 95 percent of the issues, however, I can’t support closing roads unless there is a serious need to close them for public safety and not for plants or creature concerns.

 

[Ben Ruset]

I believe that both Jason and Russ are truly interested in closing roads. I am certain I am in agreement with both of them concerning 95 percent of the issues, however, I can’t support closing roads unless there is a serious need to close them for public safety and not for plants or creature concerns.

Trying to save the forest from harm is a great thing. I've met Russ and I think he's a good person. I'm sure Jason is too. The problem is the way that they go about doing it and their absolute steadfast unwillingness to find a compromise where everyone gets a little of something that they want.