Frank's Ford, Tub Mill, and Amatol

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
Frank's Ford, Ives Branch, and Amatol

My buddy's Mom said we were crazy as we headed out the door this morning, and maybe she wasn't far off. We'd been looking at the forecasts and wrapping optimistic words around the number "28", but once we got out there we realized that with the wind we were looking at closer to 19 or 20 degrees. Still it was an absolutely beautiful, clear, crisp, bitingly cold, numbingly freezing day in the pines. My wife let me borrow her camera, so for once I get to post a real trip report without waiting for my friends to process and forward imagery. Onward!

Our first stop was a place Guy has written about recently: Frank's Ford. My friend had scouted it last week looking for a way across that didn't involve Guy's method of donning waders. What a gorgeous spot, and although the opposite shore beckons temptingly, we opted to return in the spring with the yaks.

Looking across the West Branch of the Wading just about where I think the ford and bridge were.



A sandy beach just downstream of the ford, which looks like it could be the new ford, or maybe was the old ford, or perhaps is just a beach. At the very least it looks like a good put-in.



Looking across the wetland that lies between the beach and the river as it bends around behind. Just beautiful.



Not sure if this is just inundated land, or if the river is in the process of pinching off a lake. The main stream flows behind the spit of grassy land in the background. [Edit: having looked at this more closely in the aerials I think it's just a small inlet.]



From Frank's Ford we headed south and caught Washington Pine Swamp Rd. out to 563, then south toward Harrisville. I had been wanting to check out Tub Mill for a long time, and with the temp now a balmy 22F as noon approached, this was obviously the day to do it. Our first attempt was to take Tub Mill Road north. Not happening. After fighting our way up what is basically a trail for 3/4 of a mile we halted at this:



It wasn't the water that deterred us. There are quite a few other respectable puddles on that 3/4 mile of former road. Some were as deep as perhaps 18". Maybe more. This is no road for a car, and we decided that the road you see in the pic above was no road for our trucks either. It basically disappeared into brush.

The Taco is not pleased.



The FJ licking her paint wounds.



Time for plan B, so we backed out and took Prince's Place Road north, which is what we should have done all along. Arrived at the pond on Ive's Branch and was struck by the beauty of the location.

[Edit: I've changed the title and the description of these slides because I misinterpreted the location. More in the reply on this thread]

A shot across the pond from the SE end of the dam.



Looking at the dam. This is interesting because while the fill has long-since washed away most of the turfing is still present on both sides, and people have layed planks across the gaps. The water at the lowest point looked about 20" deep to my eye. Could have done it with the trucks but we left them parked on the other side.



The outflow of Ives Branch from the mostly-broken dam. I think the appliance in the right rear qualifies as an artifact.



On the west side of the dam is a sandy rise to a high meadow. Here's a shot looking back down toward the dam from about 3/4 of the way up.



I haven't been able to find out much of anything at all about Tub Mill. It doesn't show on the old maps I have. About all I know is there's a dammed pond, and roads going to it that name it Tub Mill. It's all guesswork, really, and if anyone knows more please enlighten me. We had hoped to find some evidence of habitation or works on the high ground to the NW, simply because it was where we'd want to build auxiliary structures if we had works down by the pond, but we found nothing to the northwest, except beauty.

[Edit: I've clarified the location further and had it wrong. We were on a dammed pond on Ives Branch, not Tub Mill Branch. See reply on this thread.]

Here's a shot looking across the high meadow. There may be a dog on the left of this image, if you look closely.



To the NW of the high meadow the ground falls away in a series of hollows filled with brilliant white sand.



Walking back along the shore I grabbed this shot across the pond from a different angle.



There is another rise to the south of Martha Road, SW of the dam, which is quite prominent, and almost seems artificial, but I suppose it is an offspring of the high ground to the north of it. Again we hoped to find some sign of habitation, and did discover some concrete, but I can't say much about it other than that the second one is clearly from a block.





At last we did discover positive evidence of habitation, possibly human. No, we did not check the pockets.



From Ives Branch, to which we will certainly return in warmer weather, we headed West on 542 toward Batsto, and thence on down Nesco Rd. to Columbia, to Moss Mill, to a place I have been wanting to check out since I started visiting here and learned about it. We arrived by forging our way up an overgrown road that used to bear the place's name, not really having a clear idea of what to look for. It was getting late, the cold was now pretty much a moral force every time we stepped from the warmth of the vehicles, and we had just about decided to come back another time when the texture of concrete was spotted off through the trees.



The lighting got really, really tough at this point, and only a few shots had reasonable sun. I've tried to tweak some of the best of the rest, but without a whole bunch of success.

Looking in the end of that same concrete structure. Notice something about the wall on the left. The walls are formed from cast concrete blocks. They're big. On that wall the top two courses are offset from the bottom one by almost four inches. It's easier to see in the full-size version. Something hit them pretty hard.



One of the few well-lit shots I obtained there. The framing of the trees in the window caught my eye.



A broken pine in a small space. I wish I knew how it was broken. I thought perhaps lightning, but someone could have climbed up there and pulled it down I suppose.



My friends Jack and Jon looking around. You can see the offset in the top two courses of blocks that I mentioned above.



Interplay of light and shade along a wall, just because it caught my eye. There's a notable difference between this place and Brooksbrae, which is so startling I don't really want to go into it here. I don't know what accounts for that difference, but I'm glad of it and wouldn't want it to change.



Here's a low shot of a row of anchor bolts behind one of the structures. Whatever they anchored there is no longer any sign of it. Perhaps it was sold off in 1922, or burned away.



And lastly, I thought Stu would be pleased to know that both the chair, and the toy, are still there. We didn't pose the toy on the chair, I swear. All is as we found it.

 

bobpbx

Piney
Staff member
Oct 25, 2002
14,253
4,369
Pines; Bamber area
Very nice report Mark. Nice pictures too.

Try to put them in the bigger than thumbnail size though. Its easier to read without jumping into the photo gallery.

In two weeks, God willing and the creek don't rise, I'll be the Tub Mill Branch area.
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
Try to put them in the bigger than thumbnail size though. Its easier to read without jumping into the photo gallery.

Thanks, Bob. Fixed! That was the first time I used the quote links at the bottom of the gallery pages, and didn't think about what size thumbnail I would be getting.

Sue, Frank's Ford is just south and east of Hawkins Bridge. You won't have any problems finding it on a map or sat view. The road no longer crosses the river there, so getting across requires either a vessel or Guy's willingness to put on waders. I would guess the water is about 3 feet in the middle, but it could be deeper.

Tub Mill Branch kind of flows east of Harrisville a couple of miles. The dammed pond I visited is in the center of this view.

http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=39.656687,-74.466019&spn=0.023756,0.041285&t=h&z=15&om=0

As I said in the OP, I really don't know if this pond was associated with Tub Mill, or if there was a Tub Mill at all. It seems like a good conjecture at this point, but I haven't found anything else pertaining to it.
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
More on the location I referred to as Tub Mill. I believe I have been misinterpreting the map for some time. I had previously made a correlation between Tub Mill Road and the dammed pond that seemed to be its destination, and without looking closely enough assumed that Tub Mill Branch flowed through this pond.

This afternoon I took a closer look, and by referring to old topos as well as satellite imagery I realized that the pond was created by damming Ives Branch. Tub Mill Branch flows a little to the west of Ives Branch, and Tub Mill Road runs alongside it, ultimately joining Prince Place Rd. at the pond we visited. I have to assume at this point that the pond is not related to "Tub Mill".

A Tub Mill was a kind of mill, and I presume that a tub mill lay on Tub Mill Branch at some point, and that Tub Mill Rd. gave access to that mill. I have no idea where it was yet. I also don't know the history of the old pond on Ives Branch. It doesn't show up on the George Cook topo of the area, nor is there any indication of works on Tub Mill Branch. It was referred to elsewhere on this site as the headwaters of Ives Branch, but I'm not sure that's true, or to what extent the pond was artificially created by the road/dam.

So where I had one question, I have apparently created two, and answered none :).
 

Teegate

Administrator
Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
25,656
8,266
Mark,

Nice report! You can tell the water is high since I believe your first photo is the location of the bridge that a few weeks back looked like this.


IMG_0336.JPG



And we did cross at your second photo. Also, at one of the curves slightly upstream there is a path right through a cedar swamp to Franks Ford road, but you still have to get to the other side first.

And as Bob said the Ives is a calling! :)


Guy
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
Wow, what a difference in water levels. No wonder we ran into so many deep puddles.

I've seen references to Ives Branch in early documents like the records of John Matthis' land transactions (late 1700's I think). I'm curious now as to the origins of that pond on Ives. But I'm also still very curious as to where and what "Tub Mill" was.
 

woodjin

Piney
Nov 8, 2004
4,341
327
Near Mt. Misery
Very Nice report and great photos! That is a beautiful pond isn't it. I've fished it to no avail. Very shallow and spaghnum filled. I might guess it was used for cranberries at one time. Also, not long ago there was an old row boat half sunken along the western shore. The water levels might have been too high to see it when you were there.

Jeff
 
Wow, what a difference in water levels. No wonder we ran into so many deep puddles.

I've seen references to Ives Branch in early documents like the records of John Matthis' land transactions (late 1700's I think). I'm curious now as to the origins of that pond on Ives. But I'm also still very curious as to where and what "Tub Mill" was.

Mark:

A tub mill is a very primitive mill that operated the run of grinding stones with a horizontal water wheel no larger than eight feet in diameter surrounded by a "tub," similar to more modern hydraulic turbines. The mill could operate on very little water and the direct drive technology made the mill very portable. I can't tell you precisely where the mill stood on Tub Mill Branch, but I can tell you the mill was rather ancient. An April 1759 survey of 200 acres in Little Egg Harbor Township reads in part:

BEGINNING at a pine tree Standing about one Chain above the Ruins of an old Tub Mill Lettered on WRTMIH on Ashatamans Run, Double marked on four sides it being a Corner to a Survey formerly made to William Rogers.... (SGO H:185)

As you can see from this survey, the unknown owner/operator of the tub mill had already abandoned the mill in 1759.

The Ashataman referred to in the above quote can be found with variant spellings, including Ashatama. The last person to claim this aboriginal surname as her own was Indian Ann Ashatama Roberts.

Best regards,
Jerseyman

P.S. For those of you who have sent me PMs, I will try to respond to you this weekend; my current workload precludes me from doing so before that time. Thanks for your understanding!
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
Thanks for the information, Jerseyman! That's 100% more than I knew previously. It makes sense that the name derives from a very old association, as there doesn't seem to be any indication in later maps that I have that anything was there. Do you think the name "Tub Mill Branch" might be contemporaneous with the operation of the mill? Or was it likely assigned to the creek by association with the ruins?

Fascinating stuff. I'd like to have a hunt for the spot to see if anything remains.
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
A Possible Location for (the) Tub Mill?

Spurred on by Jerseyman's dates I took another look at some scans of old maps. I had obviously been looking in the wrong place anyway, being fixated on the large pond on Ives Branch. Here's what I discovered in an 1833 map by Thomas Gordon:



The symbol I've circled in red is for a "Mill or Manufactory." Notice that it shows the mill on the SE corner of the cross made by what is now 679 and Tub Mill Branch, with a pond backing up on the north side of the road. Here's a detail of that crossing from Google Earth:



The outline of the pond as show in Gordon's map is pretty evident. As for the road, the indications are faint but I think you can argue it lay north of where 679 is now, along the line of a dam. Here's a marked up version of the satellite image to show how I think it correlates with Gordon:



I think it's pretty evident from the above that this was the location of whatever "Mill or Manufactory" Gordon placed there. The question I have is whether the Gordon map is too late to be referring to Tub Mill? Perhaps there was another, later mill that he recorded. In any event, an interesting puzzle and maybe an indication that it's worth poking around in that area.
 

bobpbx

Piney
Staff member
Oct 25, 2002
14,253
4,369
Pines; Bamber area
Mark, they had something wrong in the old map. They show the Mill east of Bridgeport, which is now Wading River. You are showing the actual named creek well upstream from there. The one now named Tub Mill Branch does not have enough water to dampen a dish towel.
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
Mark, they had something wrong in the old map. They show the Mill east of Bridgeport, which is now Wading River. You are showing the actual named creek well upstream from there. The one now named Tub Mill Branch does not have enough water to dampen a dish towel.

Yeah, I assumed the map maker just got it wrong. The map is of the whole state, and there are a lot of features missing. Ives Branch isn't even shown, for example, even though it's larger, probably because there was nothing notable on it. I keyed off of the name of the stream and the road crossing, and came up with the visual indications above. Still, could just be my imagination.
 
Mark, they had something wrong in the old map. They show the Mill east of Bridgeport, which is now Wading River. You are showing the actual named creek well upstream from there. The one now named Tub Mill Branch does not have enough water to dampen a dish towel.


Mark:

Bob is correct. Despite Thomas Gordon's map being the first accurate cartographic depiction of the New Jersey, it is not without problems, including the mislabeling of Ives Branch as Tub Mill Branch. The latter stream is actually the first unlabeled stream up the Wading River from the Ives Branch. The original 1828 Gordon is the first map to call the stream "Tub Mill Branch," even if he did insert the label on the wrong stream. The 1833 Gordon, the one here on Ben's site, was a corrected version of his original 1828 map, but obviously Gordon did not pick up all of the errors!

I do not believe that Tub Mill Branch ever powered another mill once the original tub mill closed down. Don't forget that prior to being called Tub Mill Branch, the more ancient name for this watercourse was Ashatama or Ashataman Run--with all of its spelling variations.

If you take another look at the Gordon map detail you display above and compare it with a modern map, you will find that the road crossing the mislabeled Ives Branch at the mill depicted is actually County Route 542, not 679.

Best regards,
Jerseyman
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
Yep, I can see it clear as day now, especially the triangle made by 542, 653, and the Ives Branch. Oh well, guess the bad news is that isn't the location of Tub Mill. The good news is there was a mill on Ives Branch where it crosses that road, according to the map. Do we know anything about that site?

Edit: I see an 'Old Bass River Mill Rd' heading down that way, so perhaps that's the mill on the Gordon map.
 

Oriental

Explorer
Apr 21, 2005
253
133
We had hoped to find some evidence of habitation or works on the high ground to the NW, simply because it was where we'd want to build auxiliary structures if we had works down by the pond, but we found nothing to the northwest, except beauty.

You must have walked right around the ruins of the Highland Park Field and Stream Club that was right on the rise to the NW of the lake. I was there a few months ago and the jacket was hanging from the tree even then. You can clearly see the outline of the foundation, the poured concrete front step, and a few bolts that at one time must have been anchors for a roof over the entrance. This is probably 50 feet from the Batona Trail. What a beaufiful area. Did you see the submerged row boat along the edge of the pond?

In a very recent post, "Searching for 3 gun clubs", Trailotter makes mention of the site. Check it out. I always wanted to know more about the club. If anyone has any info, please pass it along.

Also, in "Heart of the Pines" the chapter on Half Moon and Chips Folly describes the construction of a ram pump for the Wading River Game Association. I believe this may have been on the tub mill branch, not far from where it dumps into the wading river. Evidence of a dam can still be seen. It's not Tub Mill but I always wondered if the locations coincided.
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
I saw your pics of the jacket, Oriental, and of the pond. Nice shots. Anyway, wow, what a miss by us. We walked up onto that hilltop, to the area around the jacket and a little beyond, then back down along the creek. Missed the gun club ruins completely, or I would have included photos of them. Are they further NW on the hilltop from the jacket?
 

Oriental

Explorer
Apr 21, 2005
253
133
As you cross the "dam" there is a rise on the right. The site may have been a little further from the lake than you explored but still not far. The remains are much closer to the road that crosses the dam than they are to the open area you photographed. I don't know if the open area was a feed plot, parking lot or shooting range but clearly it is a disturbed area. I think the view from the hill down to the pond it just awesome.
 

MarkBNJ

Piney
Jun 17, 2007
1,875
73
Long Valley, NJ
www.markbetz.net
As you cross the "dam" there is a rise on the right. The site may have been a little further from the lake than you explored but still not far. The remains are much closer to the road that crosses the dam than they are to the open area you photographed. I don't know if the open area was a feed plot, parking lot or shooting range but clearly it is a disturbed area. I think the view from the hill down to the pond it just awesome.

Ah, so they are on the north side of the road, not near the jacket. I know exactly the spot you mean now. We missed it because we walked NW up the hill nearer the pond. If we had followed the road a little further west around the hill we would have run into it. I've marked it for another visit.

You're right about the view from the hilltop, especially since it is so open. It almost seems as if that hill, and the hill the jacket is on, were once the same rise, and it was cut through for the road, but I don't know how likely that is.
 
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