Harrisville Ruins

[LARGO]

While well intended, giving the specific locations of artesian wells could open the door for a whole lot of hurt rather than good. Equally as sensitive as any historical site, it would be lousy if the integrity of any were compromised due to easier access from viewers of the site. It would make a fine and interesting thread, educational as well to compare environments that they are better or poorer in. Comparative pics would be great as well. Simply another way the site can educate responsible viewers. Giving only general location is best though as seen regarding the thread of the Sawmill bases of the pines.
Once again, just my humble Opinion.
I look forward to a thread on this just the same. Maybe I'll learn something.

G.

 

[ebsi2001]

Artesian Wells and "Little Secrets"

While well intended, giving the specific locations of artesian wells could open the door for a whole lot of hurt rather than good. ...

I look forward to a thread on this just the same. Maybe I'll learn something.

G.

G.,

Today, it seems, "everything is a 'mixed bag'" --- "spoilers" abound at every corner. I am reticent to reveal some of the things I know for fear that others may wittingly or unwittingly despoil that which has not already been spoilt. However, if we all remain "mum," keeping our "little secrets" secret, future generations will not profit from our knowledge nor that of our forefathers as it will surely be lost to time...

The State may have record of such artesian well sites, and then, again, it might not... If it does, such records should be readily available to the public, although they are probably not easily accessible on the Internet. It's a "tough call," but maybe Guy, bobpbx and ben will come--up with a solution?

I have heard that there were once several artesian wells in and around Bass River, Little Egg Harbor and Stafford Townships. It seems that they are on the decrease, due to the drastic drawdown attributable to "overbuilding" --- and the enormous water usage by the casinos... If something is not done soon, the price of water will greatly exceed the price of fuel.

ebsi

 

[MuckSavage]

Artesian Well

There's one at the Weymouth Ruins. Also, a few years ago, I maintained all of the sewer grinder pumps along Cedar Run Dock Rd in Stafford/Eagleswood Twps. One of the old timers has an artesian well on his property. Whenever I was in the area, he'd see me & bring me water from the well. It was something he was really proud of. He'd always say it was the best water he'd ever tasted, etc etc, etc.....

 

[ebsi2001]

Artesian Wells, Water and German Beer

There's one at the Weymouth Ruins. Also, a few years ago, I maintained all of the sewer grinder pumps along Cedar Run Dock Rd in Stafford/Eagleswood Twps. One of the old timers has an artesian well on his property. Whenever I was in the area, he'd see me & bring me water from the well. It was something he was really proud of. He'd always say it was the best water he'd ever tasted, etc etc, etc.....

Well, the list is getting longer...

As you well know, "water" is not just "water." It takes water with a specific hardness to make good beer --- good GERMAN beer. Specifically, both sulfate and carbonate ions are required. If the hardness is not present in the water, (Biergips) "beer plaster" is added, otherwise the beer will not be good.

The only artesian well water I ever tasted, had a slightly sulfurous odor with a distinct metallic (iron) taste. Of course, such water would be unsuitable for beer brewing, unless it was treated, first...

Based on your experience, I would think that the "old timer's" water came from a different acquifer...

It would be interesting to know just how deep those old artesian wells are.

ebsi

 

[woodjin]

I'll mention this one 'cause it is rather "public". There is a nature center along the west shore of Basto lake. next to the center is a pipe with continious flow from the kirkwood cohansey aquafer. I asked the naturalist inside if he had drank from it. "all the time" he said, "and I haven't dropped dead yet". Sadly, later that day, he dropped dead...no, sorry just kidding, I am sure he is fine and he did drink from the well. Hell, that is the same aquafer I drink from and I just take a bit of the iron and acidity out. Best water in the country!!

Jeff

 

[ebsi2001]

Kirkwood Cohansey Aquifer

I'll mention this one 'cause it is rather "public". There is a nature center along the west shore of Basto lake. next to the center is a pipe with continious flow from the kirkwood cohansey aquafer. I asked the naturalist inside if he had drank from it. "all the time" he said, "and I haven't dropped dead yet". Sadly, later that day, he dropped dead...no, sorry just kidding, I am sure he is fine and he did drink from the well. Hell, that is the same aquafer I drink from and I just take a bit of the iron and acidity out. Best water in the country!!

Jeff

Jeff,

From what I understand, there are two Kirkwood Cohansey Acquifers --- one is rather shallow, while the other is deep... Do you have any idea which of the two acquifers feeds the artesian well you visited?

One or two of the casinos in A.C. supposedly taps into the deeper Kirkwood Acquifer.

I wonder if a quantitative elemental analysis of the water from those various artesian wells would reveal a "fingerprint" characteristic of the acquifer the water is coming from?

ebsi

 

[Furball1]

Well Water

I had a well in Malaga--not sure if it was tapped into the aquifers mentioned, I believe it was about 100 ft down. It was the best water I had ever tasted, but there was one drawback--I did not have a softening system, so when the water "stood" overnight in the pipes, it was essentially undrinkable until the lines were cleared of the old water---why, you may ask? The evidence became visible over time in our tubs--a bluish green residue, which I found out later when I sold the house, was due to the water having a very low pH, which leached copper from the copper lines. Also the presence of iron. These contributed to a very "metallic" taste first thing in the morning. I suspect that the "iron taste" y'all are experienceing may be due in part to the low pH of the water leaching iron from the inside of the iron pipe---but I am sure natural deposits of iron in the geologic strata in some areas could account for some places having water that is downright awful.

 

[Ben Ruset]

Here's some information on the Harrisville Well.

"In 1866, I had an artesian well sunk at Harrisville, to obtain a supply of pure water, free from iron, from which ingredient we had a great deal of trouble, causing our wrought-iron boiler to rust out rapidly," said Richard Harris, owner and operator of Harrisville.

The well at first brought up clear water, but the driller insisted on going down further. "... the result was," Harris continued, "no water of any volume and that which overflowed was impregnated with iron very strongly, which was the very thing I had wished to avoid. At this I concluded to abandon the project and declined to bore any further."

The well was bored with an eight inch auger powered by horses. Mahlon Broome, a manager at Harrisville said: "The iron casings placed in the well were joined by introducing the adjacent ends of each section into a heated iron band or collar, which, on cooling, firmy clapses them together."

The well suffered various acts of vandalism over the years, and finally burst below the surface. What we see today is the repaired well, fixed by Lesson Small, a former superintendant of the Wharton Estate.

Source: Paper Town of the Pine Barrens by Michael Fowler & William A. Herbert, Environmental Education Publishing Service, Eatontown, NJ 1976.

 

[ebsi2001]

low pH

...when the water "stood" overnight in the pipes, it was essentially undrinkable until the lines were cleared of the old water---why, you may ask? The evidence became visible over time in our tubs--a bluish green residue, which I found out later when I sold the house, was due to the water having a very low pH, which leached copper from the copper lines. Also the presence of iron. These contributed to a very "metallic" taste first thing in the morning. ... .

Furball,

Be happy you sold your place. If your well water had a low pH, low enough that it leached copper and iron from your pipes, it probably leached lead from the "sweated" joints in your copper lines, too. Such leached lead is highly poisonous.

ebsi

 

[ebsi2001]

Harrisville Artesian Well

Here's some information on the Harrisville Well.

"In 1866, I had an artesian well sunk at Harrisville, to obtain a supply of pure water, free from iron, from which ingredient we had a great deal of trouble, causing our wrought-iron boiler to rust out rapidly," said Richard Harris, owner and operator of Harrisville.

The well at first brought up clear water, but the driller insisted on going down further. "... the result was," Harris continued, "no water of any volume and that which overflowed was impregnated with iron very strongly, which was the very thing I had wished to avoid. At this I concluded to abandon the project and declined to bore any further."

The well was bored with an eight inch auger powered by horses. Mahlon Broome, a manager at Harrisville said: "The iron casings placed in the well were joined by introducing the adjacent ends of each section into a heated iron band or collar, which, on cooling, firmy clapses them together."

The well suffered various acts of vandalism over the years, and finally burst below the surface. What we see today is the repaired well, fixed by Lesson Small, a former superintendant of the Wharton Estate.

Source: Paper Town of the Pine Barrens by Michael Fowler & William A. Herbert, Environmental Education Publishing Service, Eatontown, NJ 1976.

Ben,

That's a mighty nice piece of information about "old technology"... I find it very interesting that the lengths of well casing were simply held together by heated "collars" that contracted upon cooling.

I wonder how deep that well is, and what its output is??

Where does the "run off" go?

ebsi

 

[woodjin]

I don't recall that the run off on that well is directed anywhere specific. It just runs out and meanders its way down hill, which I guess would probably lead back to the wading river.

 

[ebsi2001]

Artesian Well Run--Off

I don't recall that the run off on that well is directed anywhere specific. It just runs out and meanders its way down hill, which I guess would probably lead back to the wading river.

Thanks, Jeff!

Many people do NOT realize just how important water is to the S.J. ecosystem. We waste a lot of water --- needlessly. Some water that has not been polluted could be redirected to specific sites in The Pines where it could be used to recharge our acquifers. Artesian well water run--off, for the most part, is "unchanged," and, therefore, certainly, could be put to better use in such "recharging operations."

There has been some discussion about recharging ground water supplies with "treated water" (treated sewage effluent), but this is not a good idea, unless the water has undergone more extensive treatment(s) (additional treatment steps) than are currently employed.

If something is not done soon, we, in S.J., shall quite possibly pay more for clean, potable, water than for fuel, while some of the reserves in our acquifers are pumped to North Jersey to meet their ever--increasing demand. At the same time, "drawdown," especially in the greater A.C. area (and as far south as Cape May), reduces the amount of water available to our own communities, while, at the same time, "overdevelopment" in the same area steadily increases demand...

Currently, a big controversy is raging in CA, because the town of Huntinton Beach wants a CT Co. to errect a large desalination plant there. This current controversy bears careful scrutiny, since we, in S.J., may eventually be forced into considering a similar project in the not so distant future.

ebsi

P.S.: Based on your experience in The Pines, what would be your reaction to errecting a "wind farm" there --- of a limited size, of course; and if you felt the conditions in The Pines were "conducive" to the economical production of energy from such a wind farm, where in The Pines do you think such a wind farm could/should be errected --- i.e. where it would pose the least threat to the environment?

e.

 

[Boyd]

Based on your experience in The Pines, what would be your reaction to errecting a "wind farm" there

Personally I can't think of anywhere that I'd like to see such a thing built in the pines. But of course, if it's on private property and there isn't a specific prohibition then no doubt it will happen someday. I believe there's already a wind farm right outside Atlantic City, isn't there? Seems like coastal areas would be the logical place to locate such a thing.

 

[ebsi2001]

"Pinelands Wind Farm"

Personally I can't think of anywhere that I'd like to see such a thing built in the pines. But of course, if it's on private property and there isn't a specific prohibition then no doubt it will happen someday. I believe there's already a wind farm right outside Atlantic City, isn't there? Seems like coastal areas would be the logical place to locate such a thing.

Dear Boyd,

Thank you for your reply.

Yes, the ACUA has a small wind farm just outside of A.C. on the marsches --- near their sewage treatment plant; and, yes, there have been "trial balloons" in the Press suggesting building a large--to--very large wind farm offshore...

There have been several concerns about these things: Germany probably was one of the pioneers in this area, with some units installed along their North Sea Coast. However, when those units became "unstable," and could not be repaired easily, the German government had them dismantled.

I could imagine that an offshore wind farm would be very difficult to maintain; and, of course, there are a wide variety of issues --- from pernacious corrosion to the imminent threat of destruction by hurricanes --- that would have to be addressed. TIP: look at what happened to the "Texas Tower," which was located off of Barnegat Light (I believe)...

Although The Pines is probably not an ideal site for a large wind farm, perhaps a small wind farm would produce enough "clean energy" to run (a) tertiary waste treatment facility/facilities (reverse osmosis) to prepare waste water for ground water "recharging" operations, which, we will probably need in the not too distant future...

As you may know, the plains heat--up during the morning hours, creating an updraught. If that steady updraught is large enough to power the windmill turbines at an economical rate, deriving energy from such "wind farms" might be a better choice than building new nuclear generating plants...

ebsi

 

[LARGO]

Texas Tower 4

The tragedy that was Texas Tower 4 was a direct result of negligence, GRAND SCALE. Hopefully in some 45 odd years we've come farther along technologically and responsibly to maintain seriously equipment and persons supplying much needed alternate power. Yes you are right about the location, some 70 plus miles from Barnegat inlet.
I think wind farms are great, Just no one wants to see them. Classic case. We'll bitch about what we need but we don't want to 'see" the solution.
But then, I'll pass on a nuclear power plant in Waterford.

G.

 

[ebsi2001]

Human Nature, "Progress" and Wind Farms

.... Hopefully in some 45 odd years we've come farther along technologically and responsibly to maintain seriously equipment and persons supplying much needed alternate power. ...
I think wind farms are great, Just no one wants to see them. Classic case. We'll bitch about what we need but we don't want to 'see" the solution.
But then, I'll pass on a nuclear power plant in Waterford.

G.

Largo,

It would be really great if each succeeding generation would learn from its preceding generation to build a better world. Unfortunately, there is something generally called the "Seven Deadly Sins," which almost always manages to "throw a 'monkey wrench' into" the best of all intentions. Greed and sloth go hand--in--hand, so don't expect any major turn--arounds soon...

We are in very limited supply of "sources of energy" that are both "viable" and economical. Wind energy is considered to be an "economic alternative," however it does have its drawbacks... Yes, one of them ist its "unsightliness": some have complained that the windmills would obstruct their view, while others complain of the "whooshing" noise they are supposed to produce. Still others maintain that it will kill innumerable birds along their major flight path. I admit, I have not visited the ACUAs wind farm in A.C., so I can't comment on the noise "issue" --- or on the presence of any dead birds under the windmills, either...

Steve Nickelsberg, an optometrist, wants to have his own source of alternative energy... Although I don't consider Strathmere the ideal site for anything except nesting sites for Piping Plovers, I can understand Dr. Nickelsberg's quest. Curiously, "Dr. Steve" is being hindered in his quest by the DEP::jeffd:

http://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/news/story/6423974p-6280131c.html

I wonder if the DEP would be just as "rigorous" if it came to errecting a small wind farm in "The Pines"?

What would be the negative impact of such a "wind farm," and who would be most likely to suffer the most from such an impact?

ebsi

 

[LARGO]

Wind Farms

Sorry to resurrect an off original topic of this thread but......
I was at Borgata this morning with a customer/buyer and the windmills are right out in site. Now, these things are placed strategically on the best possible supply source of wind. The are actually architecturally beautiful right out in the marsh if you will. Mesmerizing to watch. Now, again I had background noise but I heard nothing standoutish. That they are really all that harmful to birds is questionable. You would have to have dense flocks going in there for any serious possibility in my opinion. I do not believe however, for the good of the Pine Barrens, that there is a super area that would benefit their need for wind supply. Seems as though these big bastards need some serious drive. The serene nature of the Barrens might be interrupted by them but there are worse things. Might be an interesting contrast in an otherwise untouched area. And wouldn't it be good to know that if there was a good blow available somewhere due to geography or design, that one resource could result in the benefit of another?
Just my thoughts.

( But I still wouldn't want them right behind my house... even though I get some Kick**s wind )

G.

 

[bobpbx]

I have to say, that is compelled to say something here. I have been known to think about things differently than the general population. Well, then again, maybe not. But wait, I am going off on a tangent. Here is what I want to say; If we use up a portion of wind to make energy, are we having an effect somewhere down the line by stealing from the natural cycle? Wind is the result of sun and high and low pressure areas, right? Is there something in the cycle that needs the wind at whatever speed it was created? How about seed dispersal, or bird flight, or forest fire smoke dilution?

 

[BEHR655]

I have to say, that is compelled to say something here. I have been known to think about things differently than the general population. Well, then again, maybe not. But wait, I am going off on a tangent. Here is what I want to say; If we use up a portion of wind to make energy, are we having an effect somewhere down the line by stealing from the natural cycle? Wind is the result of sun and high and low pressure areas, right? Is there something in the cycle that needs the wind at whatever speed it was created? How about seed dispersal, or bird flight, or forest fire smoke dilution?

I never heard of a "Wind Hugger" before.

 

[woodjin]

I have to say, that is compelled to say something here. I have been known to think about things differently than the general population. Well, then again, maybe not. But wait, I am going off on a tangent. Here is what I want to say; If we use up a portion of wind to make energy, are we having an effect somewhere down the line by stealing from the natural cycle? Wind is the result of sun and high and low pressure areas, right? Is there something in the cycle that needs the wind at whatever speed it was created? How about seed dispersal, or bird flight, or forest fire smoke dilution?

It is an interesting question Bob! Having almost no knowlege of the process, common sense leads me to deduce that it's environmental impact would be minimal to non-existant (in the negative sense anyway). What Largo is saying makes alot of sense, it seems that the shore has alot more to offer in wind. Coyle field could be a possibility in the plains I would suspect. Or how about the soon to be renewed sand pit on the other side of 72?

Jeff