Pinelands Commission Resolution: MAP 2.0
- Thread starter SuperChooch
- Start date
rescheduled to 9/14 in Toms River
http://www.nj.gov/pinelands/home/meetings/documents/Public Notice -- September 8 Cancellation.pdf
I think the location hasn't been finalized yet. The last I heard was at the War Memorial in Trenton. I would wait for more info.
Here's an idea, why don't the lazy SOBs at PLC get off their arses and drive the roads on the maps? The roads that dead end or are not accessible should be closed off, end of story. The roads that are accessible, keep them open. The roads that have deep holes, fill them in like they did on Iron Pipe Road! I'm forever grateful for them fixing Iron Pipe.
Why don't they ask some of us, who have 4wds, to help them remap the forest? It's not that hard to remap everything. I would volunteer my gas, truck, and time every weekend to help remap. You get enough guys to volunteer and you'll have the forest remapped in less than a month!
Also, there are 3rd party mapmakers, like Purple Lizard Maps, who could be hired to remap the whole forest for the PLC. I would gladly pay the $15-$20 per map to have a waterproof hard copy.
And for the record, EVERYWHERE I go in the forest, I rely on Google Maps and Delorme Maps. If the road is not on Google, I don't need to be on it. Plain and simple.
Why don't they ask some of us, who have 4wds, to help them remap the forest? It's not that hard to remap everything. I would volunteer my gas, truck, and time every weekend to help remap. You get enough guys to volunteer and you'll have the forest remapped in less than a month!
Also, there are 3rd party mapmakers, like Purple Lizard Maps, who could be hired to remap the whole forest for the PLC. I would gladly pay the $15-$20 per map to have a waterproof hard copy.
And for the record, EVERYWHERE I go in the forest, I rely on Google Maps and Delorme Maps. If the road is not on Google, I don't need to be on it. Plain and simple.
Personally I would not trust Google maps for rural locations, but I also just don't trust Google.
Personally I would not trust Google maps for rural locations, but I also just don't trust Google.
I never had a single problem with google when using it in the forest. Yes there are some roads not on google and there are some on google that don't exist but for the most part, I've never had a problem. I don't use google for directions unless I'm on the motorcycle.
According to the proposal to the PLC, the roads are mapped with the suggested multi year "hybrid" "topological" maps, which if put in place will be the end all be all map of the pines from an enforcement standpoint, no Google, Delorme or other outlet. Some of the roads you mention to close are used by many folks for many reasons, if you choose not to use them it is simply that, your choice as it is my choice to use them. In my opinion,their fate needs to be considered and not just closed on conjecture of being a dead end useless road. I don't understand what you mean by inaccessible road? Inaccessible to whom it what way? if it is inaccessible is it not closed in a sense? I'm guessing you mean "legally' off limits, which may or may not be the right thing to do.I also agree on road repair, there are many that need it and have been abused and neglected for years.
OTNJ started a mapping project at the onset of the MAP ordeal a while back, which I took part in as well as many others. I don't think the information was considered in the planning of the so called MAP 2.0, so my opinion is that mapping from an outside source most likely will not be considered. Oh and as far as some of us with 4WD trucks helping I'm all for it, Keep in mind though, Guy probably goes more places in a Focus than any 4X4 that travels out there!
Keep in mind though, Guy probably goes more places in a Focus than any 4X4 that travels out there!
Had hoped to have my big HD Map of the Pines completed by now, but I'm distracted by too many other things so it may be awhile. But since Wharton maps are a hot topic again, here's my HD version of Wharton and vicinity. It's a .kmz file for Google Earth or other compatible software. This map has a resolution of 3 feet per pixel, which would be about equivalent to a map scale of 1:4000. In other words, it is 6x more detailed than a USGS 1:24000 topo map.
And this is the same area from the USGS 24k topo
My contours were generated from LIDAR at 2 foot intervals. Paved roads are from the NJDOT dataset with a resolution of +/- 1 foot. The dotted lines are tax parcels. Buildings were hand-traced from full resolution NJGIN aerial imagery. Hydro data from the USGS and NJDEP. I spent considerable time hand tracing most of the unpaved roads from aerial imagery (over 1000 miles in my full map), they should be accurate to within +/- 3 feet. Have also tried to include most of the roads from the USGS 24k topos, but those old topo maps can be off by quite a bit, so I prefer using the aerials. Don't make any assumptions about whether a road is approved or passable based on my map. I just saw something that looked like a road on an aerial image so I traced it. Caveat Emptor!
I spent a fair amount of time refining the boundaries of Wharton based on parcels. I'm sure Guy will still find many issues here, but I believe it is more accurate than any other available maps. Note that the light green shading represents forest cover and the darker green shading is public land, such as Wharton.
Another feature I spent a lot of time on is historical structures which are typically either ruins or non-existent today. I scoured all the topo's in the USGS historical map collection for these, as well as old aerial imagery where available. They're indicated as purple outlines, along with other historical features in purple. Here's an example.
Here's a download link. It only took me 25 seconds to download this on FIOS - would have taken a half hour with my old DSL! Let me know if you have any problems, just unzip the file and you should find a .kmz file inside that can be imported into Google Earth. This fall I will hopefully be able to release the full map in MOBAC format.
boydsmaps.com/download/whartonHD.zip
And this is the same area from the USGS 24k topo
My contours were generated from LIDAR at 2 foot intervals. Paved roads are from the NJDOT dataset with a resolution of +/- 1 foot. The dotted lines are tax parcels. Buildings were hand-traced from full resolution NJGIN aerial imagery. Hydro data from the USGS and NJDEP. I spent considerable time hand tracing most of the unpaved roads from aerial imagery (over 1000 miles in my full map), they should be accurate to within +/- 3 feet. Have also tried to include most of the roads from the USGS 24k topos, but those old topo maps can be off by quite a bit, so I prefer using the aerials. Don't make any assumptions about whether a road is approved or passable based on my map. I just saw something that looked like a road on an aerial image so I traced it. Caveat Emptor!
I spent a fair amount of time refining the boundaries of Wharton based on parcels. I'm sure Guy will still find many issues here, but I believe it is more accurate than any other available maps. Note that the light green shading represents forest cover and the darker green shading is public land, such as Wharton.
Another feature I spent a lot of time on is historical structures which are typically either ruins or non-existent today. I scoured all the topo's in the USGS historical map collection for these, as well as old aerial imagery where available. They're indicated as purple outlines, along with other historical features in purple. Here's an example.
Here's a download link. It only took me 25 seconds to download this on FIOS - would have taken a half hour with my old DSL!
Let me know if you have any problems, just unzip the file and you should find a .kmz file inside that can be imported into Google Earth. This fall I will hopefully be able to release the full map in MOBAC format.
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I agree that the PLC should get out there and evaluate the State Forest in person and I will gladly drive them. I do not agree with the thoughts that just because a road is not on a device or service you use, that it should be closed. Everyone is not using a device or service while they are out there because they may know where they are going and how to get there. They may use the roads that you deem unusable or unneeded by you.
I still feel that the current version of the State Forest is usable to all and the changes and patrols have helped to control the amount of damage done. I am grateful for the repairs they have made but still do not like the runway width of Washington Turnpike. I go out there to kind of get lost and enjoy nature and get away from the hustle and bustle of everyday.
NJPineBarrens.com and Open Trails NJ are taking the position that:
- We support using a USGS Topographical map to establish a baseline of roads, however the 1997 map must be used as it is last complete map of roads in Wharton State Forest.
- We believe that the Pinelands Commission act as an advisor to the DEP and provide a recommendation, but not compel, the DEP to take a specific action. The DEP is in the best position to develop a plan to protect Wharton State Forest.
Awesome Boyd! I know this took some time.This is great! Can't wait till the MOBAC issue comes out.I"ll RMP it and have it for my Triton.The tax lines are great as well as the historical buildings. Going to open what you have here now. Thanks!
Had hoped to have my big HD Map of the Pines completed by now, but I'm distracted by too many other things so it may be awhile. But since Wharton maps are a hot topic again, here's my HD version of Wharton and vicinity. It's a .kmz file for Google Earth or other compatible software. This map has a resolution of 3 feet per pixel, which would be about equivalent to a map scale of 1:4000. In other words, it is 6x more detailed than a USGS 1:24000 topo map.
View attachment 9677
And this is the same area from the USGS 24k topo
View attachment 9678
My contours were generated from LIDAR at 2 foot intervals. Paved roads are from the NJDOT dataset with a resolution of +/- 1 foot. The dotted lines are tax parcels. Buildings were hand-traced from full resolution NJGIN aerial imagery. Hydro data from the USGS and NJDEP. I spent considerable time hand tracing most of the unpaved roads from aerial imagery (over 1000 miles in my full map), they should be accurate to within +/- 3 feet. Have also tried to include most of the roads from the USGS 24k topos, but those old topo maps can be off by quite a bit, so I prefer using the aerials. Don't make any assumptions about whether a road is approved or passable based on my map. I just saw something that looked like a road on an aerial image so I traced it. Caveat Emptor!
I spent a fair amount of time refining the boundaries of Wharton based on parcels. I'm sure Guy will still find many issues here, but I believe it is more accurate than any other available maps. Note that the light green shading represents forest cover and the darker green shading is public land, such as Wharton.
Another feature I spent a lot of time on is historical structures which are typically either ruins or non-existent today. I scoured all the topo's in the USGS historical map collection for these, as well as old aerial imagery where available. They're indicated as purple outlines, along with other historical features in purple. Here's an example.
View attachment 9679
Here's a download link. It only took me 25 seconds to download this on FIOS - would have taken a half hour with my old DSL!
http://boydsmaps.com/download/whartonHD.zip
Okay Boyd I have either found a mistake or there has been a state purchase I don't know about.You have a large area immediately SE of Chatsworth marked Byrne State Forest.This area was mostly private and has some nice dune/islands in it.Did the state by this and incorporate it into Byrne?
I would have to look at the source files and my PC is shutdown for the night. But I think I was pretty careful about designating public open space. What does my older "Parcels in the Pines" map show there? This new map should have more accurate openspace though, since I only used the state's openspace file before and it is pretty old.
I have tried to incorporate parcels that are state-owned into this map. Spent a lot of time reviewing Wharton and Bass River but not much on the other state forests.
I have tried to incorporate parcels that are state-owned into this map. Spent a lot of time reviewing Wharton and Bass River but not much on the other state forests.