Pushing and Searching

MuckSavage

Explorer
Apr 1, 2005
616
237
56
Turnersville
There was an old NJ Geo monument in the woods back here in the State Woods with a mate about 1200' away along the Jersey Central tracks. I searched both of them out using the witness ties. One day while running the dogs, I found one of those monuments dug up and thrown randomly into the woods. Since I knew there was no one at the State who would ever reset it, I brought it home as a conversation piece for the handful of people on the planet that are interested in that kind of stuff.
:)
About 20 years ago I found an old Carter monument tossed at the edge of a field in Glassboro WMA. I too brought it home.
 

RednekF350

Piney
Feb 20, 2004
5,054
3,327
Pestletown, N.J.
Scott, does all of this fancy stuff eventually come back to where somebody placed a stone 200 + years ago?

Ed,

The short answer is that the "fancy stuff" really has no bearing on resolving boundaries. A stone that is called for in a deed carries more weight in the evidence rules than bearings, distances or coordinates when it is physically recovered. It doesn't matter what technique or equipment was used to recover it.

Electronic distance measurement, which started being used by surveyors on a widespread basis in the late 70's, had a huge impact on surveying fieldwork. I am old enough to remember doing huge tract outbounds with transit and tape. Alluvium in Voorhees is one of them. It took months of traversing with a 30" K&E transit turning three sets of 4 observations at every point, applying tension and temperature corrections to all measurements and using a handheld sight level to make sure the tape was level while passing through hilly terrain.

Electronic data collection was the next big thing and allowed the fieldwork to be collected in an x, y, and z format and was easily transferred into CAD for drafting.

GPS helps with searching for physical corners in remote areas if you have old surveys that are in some type of coordinate system.
For instance, Guy takes SPC 1927 coordinates from old State Forest survey maps, converts them to lat/lon using Corpscon and then goes out and searches for the corner with a handheld GPS, a poker and a keen eye.

Performing land surveying in NAD 83 and NAVD 88 coordinate realms by utilizing GPS is only done to allow mapping of projects in an accepted, Statewide system. It does nothing to discount or enhance the veracity of the locations of field evidence.

Scott
 
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bobpbx

Piney
Staff member
Oct 25, 2002
14,657
4,831
Pines; Bamber area
I gambled giving Buddy his freedom, and he enjoyed it. He lived 15 years. I know, it was a risk, but we had some great times together, and he was so fit. He would chase deer for a couple miles.

upload_2018-1-19_9-34-22.png
 

manumuskin

Piney
Jul 20, 2003
8,673
2,586
60
millville nj
www.youtube.com
I didn't know Buddy died.Sorry to hear that Bob.How long ago. I think I remember Him fro a PBX hike or two. I"d say the same about Sophie.Let her go swamping with me and if she has a seizure and dies at least she was having fun when she went but Momma won't hear it.She hasn't been out with just me since she had that real bad seizure two years ago and almost died.Momma told me not to come home without her so i told Momma from now on she only goes out with Momma along.I"m not being put on the spot of having to drag a dead 106 lb dog out of a swamp to get blamed for it by her.We take them swimming once in awhile but Sophies bushwacking days are over and Shiloh never had em because it ain't right to tale one dog without the other.
 

1Jerseydevil

Explorer
Feb 14, 2009
567
214
Not that I understand all that was explained but glad Bob asked. Haines [picc] has over the years surveyed all his property and cut new property lines. Some angle off while others are way off, approx., 300' to the North and 400' to the West. I heard he did this for tax reasons as different townships want their cut of the taxes. However I feel everyone should know exactly what they own and where. In Haines situation would his "new" property lines be updated and displayed on tax maps?
 

bobpbx

Piney
Staff member
Oct 25, 2002
14,657
4,831
Pines; Bamber area
However I feel everyone should know exactly what they own and where.

I am a HUGE proponent of the public knowing who owns what and where. I wanted to know who owned a 600 acre plot in Bass River Township, and the tax office did not even know! And, they were rude to me, and this was after 2 visits to the tax office and 3 phone calls. And, they pushed me off onto their contractor who sets up their tax bills, and even he could not help me. Really outrageous that the public cannot get this information easily.
 

Teegate

Administrator
Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
25,951
8,691
Because many of the counties do not have all of their records online as of yet, it is impossible to see online land records for many of the established land owners and older state acquisitions. You must go to the clerks office to view them. I am hopeful that many of them will eventually come online but it seems that it has been quite a while that they have been adding them online and they still only go back a few decades. Because of this many of the state acquisitions are not online.

Bob had a really tough time of it and some of the problem must be that the state does not really have a clear handle on all of the property they own. By that I mean they must not have a quick or efficient way of picking a lot and knowing the land owner or seeing the deed. Granted, many of the older deeds are confusing at best, but the tax office in Bass River should have been able to easily tell Bob who owns a property. Who do they send the tax bill to????????????????????
 

1Jerseydevil

Explorer
Feb 14, 2009
567
214
[QUOTE="Teegate, post: Who do they send the tax bill to????????????????????[/QUOTE]
That's what I'd like to know and you can bet your ass they certainly know that!!
 

bobpbx

Piney
Staff member
Oct 25, 2002
14,657
4,831
Pines; Bamber area
That's what I'd like to know and you can bet your ass they certainly know that!!

They kept saying, if it's off the tax rolls, then we wouldn't know. So then, right in front of me as I'm standing there...They called the GREEN ACRES program and asked them if it belongs to them! They said no. I kid you not!

If I found out as Mayor, I'd tell them to find out out who the hell owns it....PRONTO! It should not matter if it's taxable or not, they need to know, otherwise, how would they know! :p
 
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Teegate

Administrator
Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
25,951
8,691
A little precautionary message Al.



Over the past three years or so I have been seeing more coyote sign and I hear them at night all year long.
:)


Saw at least 5 of them today in Lebanon. This is in the same area Jeff took a video of them a few years ago.

5lebanon.jpg
 
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Teegate

Administrator
Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
25,951
8,691
They beat it quick. That was my dash cam so the quality is not that great.
 

manumuskin

Piney
Jul 20, 2003
8,673
2,586
60
millville nj
www.youtube.com
I have actually seen maybe five in my life.I hear many more at night and see scat along trails every where.I had only one that didn't beat it.he sat there looking at me in my car 30 ft away for a couple minutes.when I finally tried to get out very slowly as soon as he heard the door click open he was off like a shot.
 

imkms

Explorer
Feb 18, 2008
603
242
SJ and SW FL
I love the fact that more wild animals call the Pines their home, but in the last 30 to 40 years when the first coyote was spotted it seems their population is exploding. I’ve only seen 3 or 4 of them, but It can’t be long until their possible interactions with other animals, both domestic and wild as well as possibly people will begin to cause problems.
 

RednekF350

Piney
Feb 20, 2004
5,054
3,327
Pestletown, N.J.
Walked back to the old location of 4019 Saturday
IMG_2641.JPG
IMG_2642.JPG
IMG_2643.JPG
morning. The view is looking toward 4020.
I also photographed 4019 in my yard.
You can see that the mold for the monument is a simple galvanized bucket. The hinge for the handle is intact.
 

RednekF350

Piney
Feb 20, 2004
5,054
3,327
Pestletown, N.J.
Scott, you are a true explorer of the Pine Barrens. Ready to go out there for any suggested question. It matters not what the question is, just get me out there and back into the woods! :)

It’s my job. :)
We are running the dogs along Salters Ditch behind Atsion with Mike and his girlfriend right now.
 

Teegate

Administrator
Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
25,951
8,691
We were in the woods near Coyle Field today looking for a property stone and there really was no way we were going to find it. The area was full of pine needles with nothing sticking up out of the ground at all. Jessica makes a lucky stab at the ground and ....




The stone is located on a corner of the Spring Hill Tract. The original map of the tract was made by S. H. Shreve in July of 1880 and the stone is part of Tract 2 from that survey. Tract 2 consists of 1081.50 acres with the complete tract being 3210.14 acres. The state acquired the Spring Hill Tract from Lawrence E. Bathgate II as a trustee for many other individuals. The purchase price was $1,365,474.76.
 
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