Since the other thread was closed.

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Trailhead00

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Mar 9, 2005
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I'm not complaining about the website or about the thread being closed. I just had to chime in after ready through it. I have commented on ATV and dirtbike use in the pines in the past but just got tired of it. It is such a frustrating discussion/argument.

So I kept to myself but after reading some of the posts I had to add my 2 cents and try not to kicked out at the same time!

"If I see muddy monster trucks in Wharton, you can bet I'm going to report them, whether I saw them in the act or not" -Russel Juelg

That was the quote that really bothered me. I saw some people commented on this and maybe that was why the thread was closed down? How or why would you call the "park police" if you saw muddy trucks? You are not the authority in the state forest. That would be a total judgement call on anyone's part. What determines a muddy truck? My truck is muddy right now to some people to some other guys it just might be dirty. Where do we draw the line? Mud up to the door, the fender or covering the windshield?

I think we are getting a little too carried away. But if that is the case I'll start calling the "park police" everytime I see something that gets my attention. What if I see a guy with a shotgun, should I call the police because I think he is out shooting people or maybe he is just hunting. Maybe I don't like fishing and I think it is cruel to animals and everytime I see a guy with a fishing pole I will call the "park police" so they can make sure he has a license. I think it can snowball very quickly.

Maybe everytime I see someone walking in the pines I'll call the IRS to make sure they paid their taxes or to check to make sure they are US citizens. I'm not the police and I try not to be, I have other things to worry about. Of course if something is really wrong, like someone is in danger or something like that I would have to contact the authorities. Just because a truck is muddy wouldn't make me want to call the police. I think that is unreasonable and uncalled for. If that truck is completely legal to ride on the street he is allowed to drive in the state forest. Now if you actually see someone tearing up a mud bog on the side of the road I would say that is different, but just seeing a muddy truck I don't in any way justifies calling the police.

I was out a couple of weekends ago showing my girlfriend the Pine Barrens and we came upon a puddle. I wanted to go through it not to tear it up but to just get to the other side. Well it was much deeper and muddier than I anticpated. The end result was a very muddy truck. Now should the "park police" be called on me because my truck is muddy after doing something completely legal, I should hope not.

Like I said I don't mean to pick on anyone and I'm sure you are a nice guy but that comment sure rubbed me the wrong way. Now I will watch my back even more when I'm enjoying the pines. It will also make me think twice about driving through that puddle and enjoying more of the pine barrens.
 

russell juelg

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Jul 31, 2006
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I'm not complaining about the website or about the thread being closed. I just had to chime in after ready through it. I have commented on ATV and dirtbike use in the pines in the past but just got tired of it. It is such a frustrating discussion/argument.

So I kept to myself but after reading some of the posts I had to add my 2 cents and try not to kicked out at the same time!

"If I see muddy monster trucks in Wharton, you can bet I'm going to report them, whether I saw them in the act or not" -Russel Juelg

That was the quote that really bothered me.

I see a kind of damage out there that can ONLY be done by the big trucks. I also know people who have told me in no uncertain terms that they go out there with their big trucks to play in the mud. That's what they like to do. That's why they drive those vehicles.

No, I'm not saying that every muddy truck is evidence that the driver has been doing wrong. As I admitted earlier, when pressed on this point, everything depends on where and how you drive, not necessarily what you drive.

Even so, when I see a long line of monster trucks covered completely with mud, I think it is fair and reasonable to at least be suspicious. If I notify the park police and they go out and find the guys abiding by the law, then nobody has anything to complain about.

I think dirt bikers, ATV riders, and people who operate any kind of vehicle responsibly should do the same. The worst damage out there is being done by the big trucks, but lots of folks see that damage and say, "Look what the ORV community is doing to our wildlife habitats." Why let those guys give everybody a black eye?

Everybody who rides responsibly out there ought to be willing to draw a line between themselves and the monster truck outlaws. If you are not one of them, then you have nothing to fear from a friendly visit by the state park police.
 

Trailhead00

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Mar 9, 2005
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Haddonfield, NJ
I definitely agree that the big "monster trucks" that just go out and want to do one thing only and that is rip up the woods gives the ORV people a bad name. I go out to explore, enjoy the scenery and I admit I like to get a little muddy now and then. If I saw someone who I felt was on purpose trying to destroy a certain area I would be more inclined to call the park police. If I just see some big muddy trucks but didn't actually see them do anything I would be less likely to get involved. What constitutes a "monster truck?" I think in NJ the biggest tires you are allowed are 35", I could be wrong and once you go over 4" of suspension lift you need the stablity test performed. A truck with 35" tires might look huge to some people but not others and he would be completely legal. I just don't like getting the police involved in everything people do. Just my opinion. I also agree that it is not what you drive but how you drive it.
I guess maybe I don't like getting the police involved too much because of something that happened to me regarding what we are talking about. A few years ago me and a couple of buddies were stopped by apple pie hill, right were the kayaks are put in. I think there were 4 trucks or 3 trucks and 1 Jeep. Everything was stock, no big trucks. Just cruising around with our lunch showing our g/f's the area.
Well a ranger came up and said someone called in about 4 trucks tearing up a "bog." It wasn't us and I know we had nothing to worry about but he was so insistent. Kept asking us questions and we felt like were being accused of something. I showed him my truck that barely had any dirt on it, the other trucks were clean too, no mud at all. We had come in from Atsion and were only out there for maybe 15 minutes. Then he wanted all of our information and then wanted to see in my friends tool box and wanted to look in our trucks for alcohol. We did not have one ounce of alcohol and we knew that was a big a no no to do. I informed him that he did not have any reason to search our trucks. My friend then brough out a video camera and said he would record what was going on. He basically then dropped it and said he didn't want to see us "tearing anything up." He left almost as quickly as he appeared.
Hey I understand they have a job to do but come on man. He didn't seem to care too much about "the bog" as soon as he saw some young kids who might have alcohol. We all felt like we were harassed and that is kind of the point of going in the woods, not to be harassed! Haha. I understand as well it is a fine line we walk and if you are really not doing anything wrong you should have nothing to worry about. But that whole situation was started because someone called in about some guys tearing up a bog. Hey maybe the guy should have called and I really have more of a beef with the ranger then anything else. Maybe I'm just venting and now its out of my system I'll move on. Just one last thing anyone else find "Park Police" a little offensive, I much prefer Park Ranger.
 

russell juelg

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Jul 31, 2006
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I definitely agree that the big "monster trucks" that just go out and want to do one thing only and that is rip up the woods gives the ORV people a bad name. I go out to explore, enjoy the scenery ... We all felt like we were harassed and that is kind of the point of going in the woods, not to be harassed! ... Just one last thing anyone else find "Park Police" a little offensive, I much prefer Park Ranger.

My wife and I were out there just fishing a couple of years ago, and this conservation officer stopped by and checked out our licenses. Apparently he suspected my wife's license might be phony, so he started questioning her to a degree that I think was way out of line. I hear what you're saying. We go out there to relax and get away from stuff like that. So, okay, I'm not saying we should send the law out to check out every big truck that happens to be muddy. I hear what you're saying. I will use discretion.
 

BobNJ1979

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May 31, 2007
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if it's my truck, it's just b/c i'm a busy / lazy / tired student.. hell, truck has had mud on it for months ! and it's from the parking lot at camelback mountain, on a day when it wasn't that cold this winter (we had a lot of those)..
 
Apr 6, 2004
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trailhead said:
Just one last thing anyone else find "Park Police" a little offensive, I much prefer Park Ranger.

They are cops, not rangers. Rangers generally have good working knowledge of the woods and are there to help people interpret and enjoy the parks. We don't have rangers here.
 

Trailhead00

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Mar 9, 2005
375
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They are cops, not rangers. Rangers generally have good working knowledge of the woods and are there to help people interpret and enjoy the parks. We don't have rangers here.


I always kind of lumped them together but I guess they are different. I feel like maybe we should have more rangers around? What do you think?
 
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