I have found very few southern ringnecks.almost all have been northerns with complete yellow band.I believe the southerns are orange and broken as you say.They seem to like my woodpile
Snake!!!!
- Thread starter Teegate
- Start date
Up here - Morris County - the ones I found here are yellow orange underneath with a complete neck ring. I always liked the smell of the musk of ring-necks. Kind of sweet smelling unlike the stink of a water snake. I think it would be neat to breed some of the smaller, more colorful snakes like ring-necks, green snakes, red bellied ground snakes, etc.
So I am "assuming"... or better yet asking?... A few ways to tell a rat from a racer are climbing ability, speed, and underbelly. Otherwise I have seen a lot of images that look very similar.
A couple of years back I was walking the Batona from Carranza to Apple Pie Hill. Near the uplands of Apple Pie Hill I saw a black snake. It was early October. So the weather was no factor yet. But it went right across the trail in front of me about 30 feet away. It stopped mid trail, probably to catch the warm sun that day. I approached it and it slowly moved into the brush on the side of the trail. Not appearing to be too bothered by my presence. I am guessing that was a black rat? About ten minutes later I saw a pine snake. Again moving right across the trail. This time I was ready. I had my old flip phone camera ready. He/she was like a model. A ham that "posed" for 3 great pics before moving on to more important things. Unfortunately, I was forced by the women in my family to upgrade to a phone that was compatible with their iphones. Could not transfer any photos, so all was lost. Loved that area, because it seemed to be teeming with wildlife. Deer, birds and low crawlers. Guess I need to plan another Batona trip and make some new friends. 
those are three ways,also a black rat has keeled scales which make it look shiny,a race has smooth scales which make it look flat black.
yes if it crawled away slowly it was most likely a rat. A racer would have sped away at high speed.The only place your likely to see racers in the barrens are in or around fields and junk.In the deep woods it was most likely a rat.
Manmuskin,
Thanks for the info. Nice area you are in down there. Would like to explore the WMA down there some day. Any good advice?
Thanks for the info. Nice area you are in down there. Would like to explore the WMA down there some day. Any good advice?
Hi Al,
The ringnecks that you found, do they have a belly without markings?
Or do their bellies look like this guy below?
The ringnecks that you found, do they have a belly without markings?
Or do their bellies look like this guy below?
NJ Chile Head , I actually find both . I'm in Southern Monmouth , " The intergrade " zone . The 2nd one , the Southern Ring neck predominates . Also , The Milk snakes over here are both "coastal " as well as the darker Eastern Milk. In certain areas you can actually find both ( Species of Milk ) , a couple of miles apart .
Joe
Joe
Hi Al,
The ringnecks that you found, do they have a belly without markings?
Or do their bellies look like this guy below?
What is it you like.I assume your referring to Millville/ Bevan WMA.Buckshutem Swamp is a first rate cedar swamp.Best to explore it now before the Autosports parks starts up or the whole time your there you'll feel like you have your head in a hive of bees.A real nice cedar bog down in there,you'll feel like your in Wharton when your there.There are also a lot of old Baileytown foundations if your of a historical bent.Also a lot of Owls and Coyotes sounding off at night depending on time of year.Also attached to the WMA to the south is bear swamp.Very unbarrens like but a very cool place in it's own right.If you want an upland barrens type feel I'd suggest Manumuskin Preserve or select areas of Peaslees.I work odd days and hours (rotating shifts) but if you want company let me know and we can check schedules.
I have never really paid attention to the bellies,I usually check ring color and weather it's broken or not but I"d have to say that most every one I"ve found have the markings on the belly.Whats the difference? I have read that southerns have orange rings and that the ring is broken.I have found very few snakes like that and it was a long time ago.I"d say all the ringnecks I"ve found in the last ten years have been northerns with a whole yellow ring.
Manumuskin ,Not certain , but I think the belly markings are associated with the Southern ring neck . Monmouth / Ocean Co they are found in a very broad habitat range . Wet / dry , artificial cover , dry sandy areas , dry grass. I have actually seen them out @ night, on "the crawl " in Sept / Oct while fishing . I just recently read they are mildly venomous as well as constrictors ?? This is the 1st time I have ever heard of any snake being a constrictor and having venom ?? Does this sound right to you ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diadophis_punctatus Thanks !!
For some reason I am having trouble quoting posts, but this is for Joc. What you had written about the ringnecks is the reason why I asked Al the question. I found ringnecks in Monmouth County that had the complete neck band and belly markings, but I also found them up in Somerset county, which surprised me because I thought that there was a complete transition at that point to Northerns (no belly markings, complete neck bands). I realized that the intergrade zone went further north than I thought, but I was wondering how far south the pure Northerns went.
Interestingly, I understand that several of the Pine Barrens outliers in Middlesex County have Southern ringnecks (broken neck ring/belly markings) with no intergradation. Weird.
Al, just curious about those belly markings because if it is a complete neck band with no markings at all on belly, it's a pure Northern ringneck where a pure southern has the incomplete band with belly markings. A hybrid has the complete band with belly markings. I'm just wondering how far South the range is for the pure Northerns
Interestingly, I understand that several of the Pine Barrens outliers in Middlesex County have Southern ringnecks (broken neck ring/belly markings) with no intergradation. Weird.
Al, just curious about those belly markings because if it is a complete neck band with no markings at all on belly, it's a pure Northern ringneck where a pure southern has the incomplete band with belly markings. A hybrid has the complete band with belly markings. I'm just wondering how far South the range is for the pure Northerns
I was not aware of the whole belly marking thing.I am going to have to start paying attention to that.I always based my identification on the color of the neck ring and weather it was broken or not.Most snakes I catch down here have yellow neck rings and are unbroken.I have taken that to be Northerns.I will have to strike up a conversation with one and listen to the accent
I have just checked petersons field guide and these two snakes are the same species though divided into subspecies as of the writing of the book.The northern has either a blank belly or very small spots up the center whereas the southern has bold black half moons up the center and south jersey is shown as the intergrade zone on the map.I am definitely going to have to start doing belly checks.
I have just checked petersons field guide and these two snakes are the same species though divided into subspecies as of the writing of the book.The northern has either a blank belly or very small spots up the center whereas the southern has bold black half moons up the center and south jersey is shown as the intergrade zone on the map.I am definitely going to have to start doing belly checks.
Joc
I have never heard of a venomous constrictor.If they kill by constriction then why the venom?seems like overkill,pardon the pun.I have heard that Hognoses are venomous but could never induce one to bite me to find out and I had one as a pet for nine years.I believe that any venom they have is actually poison in their mouth from ingesting toads.I would say that Ringnecks being venomous would be false but since they are way too small to bite and I"ve never seen one try that I really could not tell.They overpower their prey and there is no sign that I have seen of a bite and wait and see approach that venomous snakes use.
I have never heard of a venomous constrictor.If they kill by constriction then why the venom?seems like overkill,pardon the pun.I have heard that Hognoses are venomous but could never induce one to bite me to find out and I had one as a pet for nine years.I believe that any venom they have is actually poison in their mouth from ingesting toads.I would say that Ringnecks being venomous would be false but since they are way too small to bite and I"ve never seen one try that I really could not tell.They overpower their prey and there is no sign that I have seen of a bite and wait and see approach that venomous snakes use.
I"ve handled spadefoots with no bad reaction.All i can say is if you ever handle a Hyla andersoni DO NOT put your fingers in your eyes. I thought I was going to go blind.The most intense pain I think I ever had.I stuck my face in a mud puddle to get the slime out of my eye.
These pictures are not from our Pine Barrens but from a Loblolly/Long Leaf Pine & mixed hardwood forest at Merchants Millpond State Park in NC. We were hosted by Floyd and Signa Williams, who are naturalists and retired rangers. We were in search of the rare Trillium pusillum
, which they had discovered here. These pix are of a big cottonmouth in dry upland on path’s edge that Signa & Ro walked right by but Floyd grabbed my arm and pulled me off the path. The cottonmouth opened it’s mouth at us and kept it open while being photographed. He began to shake his tail and Floyd said it was telling us to “get the H--l out of my area”. We did and it kept gaping even when we were 50 feet down the trail. First time I'd ever seen a cottonmouth......
