5 charged with setting bonfire that ignited forest fire that burned 11K acres of N.J. Pinelands

[Boyd]

Since we're already so far off topic....

I have taken hundreds of pictures over the years around Spring Hill, it's always been one of my favorite places. Here are few, just for fun.

Bear Swamp Hill as seen from one of the trails near the gravel pit on 5/11/2000. Hard for me to believe that was 20 years ago!

Here's a view from the overlook that was discussed above, taken on 8/6/2004

I *think* this was also taken from that spot during a forest fire on 5/16/2007

Caught this lightning flash from the gravel pit on 11/25/2005

And the boydsmaps header was created from a series of photos taken at the gravel pit on 5/10/2007

https://online.boydsmaps.com/help-topics/

 

[Teegate]

I have the text version of the complete Haines survey. However, there are major errors in it and because of that I can't proceed beyond a certain point or I would be able to say yes or no from my point of view. The state tax records show the owner of that pit to be "unknown."

So I just spent some time looking over the Haines survey, and I have found that area. I have absolute corners so I can work my way around and get a nice map of his property lines. I will work on that this weekend.

 

[bobpbx]

By the way, they have all the names of the accused.

https://www.nj.com/burlington/2020/...re-that-burned-11k-acres-of-nj-pinelands.html

 

[c1nj]

"I know I'm gonna hear from Sammy on this, but the articles say the fire burned for a month. I find that difficult to believe. I don't think you should include smoldering stumps."

A fire is designated "out" when there is 100 percent extinguishment.

The designation of "under control" means the fire is still burning/smoldering but it is unlikely to escape its control perimeter.

 

[Toothy Critter]

Big fan of the lightning strike

 

[Boyd]

Would love to claim that I timed that perfectly, however it's actually a single frame from a video of the storm that I was shooting with my new HD camera.

 

[1Jerseydevil]

So I just spent some time looking over the Haines survey, and I have found that area. I have absolute corners so I can work my way around and get a nice map of his property lines. I will work on that this weekend.

It's been a while since I've explored the property lines, actually shortly after they were cut. I seem to remember seeing new corner monuments, which would make perfect sense so they shouldn't be hard to locate.

 

[Teegate]

I have visited many of them. However, I do not have them plotted on my master map to show. Hopefully soon.

 

[1Jerseydevil]

I show the gravel pit on my Map of the Pines HD

https://online.boydsmaps.com/#17/39.76668/-74.44895/pinesHD

View attachment 13376

It is also shown on the USGS 24k topo, but that area is so cluttered that it isn't obvious. Look closely and you will see the "crossed shovels" icon and also a small blue-tinted area that denotes the clearing. The grid line and the road are right on top of it, so it's very hard to see. That is why I make my maps at a scale of 1:3000 instead of 1:24000 like the USGS. That is 8x the scale, but 64 times more data (8 x 8).

https://online.boydsmaps.com/#16/39.7667/-74.4489/pines1999

View attachment 13373

The USGS 24k topo does imply it is a "range" by the way it's labelled. However, the Geographic Name Information System (GNIS) includes a "summit" for Spring Hill, which is what I used on my map. If you look at the LIDAR imagery however, it does look like a "range". Of course, anyone but us Flatlanders would get a good laugh about calling that a mountain range.

https://lidar.boydsmaps.com/#x111y044/shader/-109/573/346/-109/1/346/1255/294/-980/100/2.5/2d

View attachment 13374

I show the gravel pit on my Map of the Pines HD

https://online.boydsmaps.com/#17/39.76668/-74.44895/pinesHD

View attachment 13376

It is also shown on the USGS 24k topo, but that area is so cluttered that it isn't obvious. Look closely and you will see the "crossed shovels" icon and also a small blue-tinted area that denotes the clearing. The grid line and the road are right on top of it, so it's very hard to see. That is why I make my maps at a scale of 1:3000 instead of 1:24000 like the USGS. That is 8x the scale, but 64 times more data (8 x 8).

https://online.boydsmaps.com/#16/39.7667/-74.4489/pines1999

View attachment 13373

The USGS 24k topo does imply it is a "range" by the way it's labelled. However, the Geographic Name Information System (GNIS) includes a "summit" for Spring Hill, which is what I used on my map. If you look at the LIDAR imagery however, it does look like a "range". Of course, anyone but us Flatlanders would get a good laugh about calling that a mountain range.

https://lidar.boydsmaps.com/#x111y044/shader/-109/573/346/-109/1/346/1255/294/-980/100/2.5/2d

View attachment 13374

Yes, I see the pit now that you pointed it out. It really is obscured.

 

[1Jerseydevil]

I have visited many of them. However, I do not have them plotted on my master map to show. Hopefully soon.

I would be interested in seeing the master map when completed if possible.

 

[Teegate]

I would be interested in seeing the master map when completed if possible.

I don't think I can complete it because there are errors. But I may be able to do most of it. I started working on it in the area of the old Pine Barren canoe rentals on 563. If you stop there you will see a monument on the front corner of the property. But after the survey leaves there I was stopped by mistakes. So what I did yesterday was to measure a few distances on the aerials in the area of the fire and came up with a distance I felt was correct. Then went through the complete survey and found one that matched. After measuring the lines next to it they also matched, so I know I have the correct spot. I have the survey of the Nature Convercency property next to Haines and will use their survey to have an exact starting point.

 

[Teegate]

I just did the first one and it is exact.

 

[1Jerseydevil]

Does the NC actually do a physical survey? I know they should, but do they actually do it? I imagine they would place corner monuments but not clear the actual lines like Haines?

 

[bobpbx]

The Nature Conservancy had several thousand acres in the Forked River Mountain area and I don't recall seeing any clearings.

 

[Teegate]

I just had a second to get back on it and it appears he conflicts with the Nature Conservancy survey. I will check this all out when I have more done.

 

[Teegate]

This is a strange survey. I calculated to a large stone I found and this survey says it is 120 feet from where I found it. Then I move on to the next location and you would think I would be 120 feet off. I am within 9 feet. This is the problem I have had with this.

 

[Teegate]

I have done from Oswego Lake all the way to Goose Pond. Here is the area where we were discussing. It is interesting to see that he does not own the portion where the arrow is pointing. That seems odd to me but his own surveyor shows him not owning it.

 

[bobpbx]

So he does own the rectangle?

 

[1Jerseydevil]

So he does own the rectangle?

No, he owns all around it. The rectangle is part of Penn State. So, the bonfire was on state property and spread to private property, vise versa of what was reported.

 

[1Jerseydevil]

The Nature Conservancy had several thousand acres in the Forked River Mountain area and I don't recall seeing any clearings.

What do you mean had, don't they still have? UH, wait a second. Did they donate their land to Ocean county? I'm aware of what they own there from seeing the posted signs. I never saw the survey clearings either. Do surveyors still use transits or laser versions? I'm aware gps is used now but for exact accuracy wouldn't they still want a line of sight? I don't get involved like Guy with property corners, but I haven't noticed even a few trees cut in order for a line of sight if that is still needed. Who's the surveyor here, I need guidance.