thats a great attitude , what have you done to try to protect the pines ?I'll second that motion. This topic has been argued ad-infinitum. Good luck with the signs, I think you're going to need a lot of them.
Closed to Mortorized Vehicles
- Thread starter ecampbell
- Start date
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Oh no! Not again...
I have some questions - who is actually posting this area? It appears to me a "coalition" or "pact" is the culprit? Who gave them the authority to post the STATE owned property?
Folks, this area has been the center of attention (by a few loud voices) to be banned from all activity; except for their own pleasure... How is that fair? Should everyone be penalized for the few that destroy the area? That doesn’t seen fair to me. I would think the forestry division would patrol the area in the off hours (or seek the help from the NJSP) to site such criminal activities, than to shut it down totally. To be honest, I would ignore any posting that was not officially posted by the state as a coalition does not have the right to make law!
Let’s hear it…
I have some questions - who is actually posting this area? It appears to me a "coalition" or "pact" is the culprit? Who gave them the authority to post the STATE owned property?
Folks, this area has been the center of attention (by a few loud voices) to be banned from all activity; except for their own pleasure... How is that fair? Should everyone be penalized for the few that destroy the area? That doesn’t seen fair to me. I would think the forestry division would patrol the area in the off hours (or seek the help from the NJSP) to site such criminal activities, than to shut it down totally. To be honest, I would ignore any posting that was not officially posted by the state as a coalition does not have the right to make law!
Let’s hear it…
you need to read previous posts before you post up something like that , THE SIGNS ARE PUT UP BY THE SUPER INTENDANT OF WHARTON HIMSELF with volunteers there to assist him , have fun ignoreing the signs you will be fined the same way as anyone back there actually 4 wheeling ,you were never allowed to drive motor vehicle in that area to begin with , and we are a coalition to help and no way is the njtlc any form of mulisha to go out there and do what they want and post what they want
Hike
im hiking the Batona starting fri AM. buttonwood and batona camps. ill take pic's as i go through that area. i have no opinion on this yet, but am following the thread.
im hiking the Batona starting fri AM. buttonwood and batona camps. ill take pic's as i go through that area. i have no opinion on this yet, but am following the thread.
Stop yelling at me - I'm sensative
So, what you are saying is that road (that is not posted) is not supposed to be used by motor vehicles?
It appears to say that Hay was already closed to motorized traffic between Fire Line and Hampton as of its publication date in 2000. So... Hay was not open from the furnace to Quaker Bridge? If not, then what are we losing here?
Maybe it's because us folks crying behind our keyboards realize that posting signs is not going to do anything, and are calling folks out for thinking that they will. The only real solution is enforcement, and nobody is giving any good explanations on why there aren't (and haven't been) rangers out there patrolling.
thats the thing , nothing is being lost in addition to what was already marked as no motor vehicles , all the new signs are replacing old ones and marking newer made trails leading into and only to 1/4 mile area , why is that so hard for people comprehend ??
i hiked lower forge/batona 5 times this year. each time a different way. i never saw no vehicle signs and never remember one north of lower forge since the 70's? i have trouble comprehending things, so I am one of the people you must be talking about, because you lost me...............
just because you didnt see a sign it doesnt mean you were allowed there , signs have been ripped down and years ago people were alot more respectful and the issue wasnt as big of a problem , if i own a peice of land and you happen to drive by it is ok if you tresspass on my property just because there isnt a sign ?
and ben the signs are being reput up now to give people a fair warning who dont know better and to give the ranger a legit guide line so there is no argument from the general public if they are or arent allowed there when tickets are issued
Ignorance of the law is not a defense.
Many have tried. If you need proof, go urinate in public and when you get the summons, tell the judge there was no sign posted. Let us know how many days you get. Last post for me on this thread.
come on now really ? thats just common sense , if your out in the woods and theres a lot of newer people that explore the pines and apprently by this thread a bunch of veterans to the pines werent aware of place you couldnt drive , just driving thru the woods and seeing a wide open trail thats not posted you would assume you could drive down it, simply posting signs is fair warning , every other state park has gates and such clearly stating no motor vehicles , not many places in the middle of wharton is there any legit signage of NMVIgnorance of the law is not a defense.
Last post for me on this thread.
There's no real debate as far as I can see. There are no historical through roads in the marked area other than Hay, and the 1970 map shows that Hay was designated as no vehicles at that time. In the 1995 aerial there are no roads at all south of the tracks between High Crossing and Hay Rd. Clearly all those roads south of the tracks were created by either wheelers or the forestry guys, and we don't have motorized rights of access to them. Hay Rd. is historical, but obviously they took whatever steps they needed to 40 years ago to mark it off-limits. I don't think we can dispute that now.
I'm firmly on the access-maintenance side of the fence here, but I don't think we're helping ourselves by not addressing the real picture. This closure does not remove right of access to one historically accessible road, as far as I can see. So someone tell me where I'm wrong.
Thanks for posting that map 46er - that clarified it for me! I knew some of the roads have been part of the wilderness area for a long time, but I wasn't sure if Hay Road was one of them.
It's pretty much all been said
and all the information is here for anyone that wants to read through this thread.
I'm not posting to it anymore - but PLEASE update us if you happen to see Park Police in the area or hear of anyone getting a ticket...
The lines have been drawn, the lines have been discussed, the lines have been defended, but the lines have yet to be
ENFORCED
It's pretty much all been said
and all the information is here for anyone that wants to read through this thread. I'm not posting to it anymore - but PLEASE update us if you happen to see Park Police in the area or hear of anyone getting a ticket...
The lines have been drawn, the lines have been discussed, the lines have been defended, but the lines have yet to be
ENFORCED
This is a Quote from NJTLC page from Devilstoy
Re: Project #1 complete/started
« Reply #29 Today at 11:00am »[SIZE=-1]
[/SIZE] the njpb forums just never seem to stop and people just have no common sense and fail to see to anything else then what they want to ,this is a recent post on there
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have some questions - who is actually posting this area? It appears to me a "coalition" or "pact" is the culprit? Who gave them the authority to post the STATE owned property
Folks, this area has been the center of attention (by a few loud voices) to be banned from all activity; except for their own pleasure... How is that fair? Should everyone be penalized for the few that destroy the area? That doesn’t seen fair to me. I would think the forestry division would patrol the area in the off hours (or seek the help from the NJSP) to site such criminal activities, than to shut it down totally. To be honest, I would ignore any posting that was not officially posted by the state as a coalition does not have the right to make law!
« Reply #29 Today at 11:00am »[SIZE=-1]
[/SIZE] the njpb forums just never seem to stop and people just have no common sense and fail to see to anything else then what they want to ,this is a recent post on there -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have some questions - who is actually posting this area? It appears to me a "coalition" or "pact" is the culprit? Who gave them the authority to post the STATE owned property
Folks, this area has been the center of attention (by a few loud voices) to be banned from all activity; except for their own pleasure... How is that fair? Should everyone be penalized for the few that destroy the area? That doesn’t seen fair to me. I would think the forestry division would patrol the area in the off hours (or seek the help from the NJSP) to site such criminal activities, than to shut it down totally. To be honest, I would ignore any posting that was not officially posted by the state as a coalition does not have the right to make law!
This is a Quote from NJTLC page from Devilstoy
Re: Project #1 complete/started
« Reply #29 Today at 11:00am »[SIZE=-1]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have some questions - who is actually posting this area? It appears to me a "coalition" or "pact" is the culprit? Who gave them the authority to post the STATE owned property
Folks, this area has been the center of attention (by a few loud voices) to be banned from all activity; except for their own pleasure... How is that fair? Should everyone be penalized for the few that destroy the area? That doesn’t seen fair to me. I would think the forestry division would patrol the area in the off hours (or seek the help from the NJSP) to site such criminal activities, than to shut it down totally. To be honest, I would ignore any posting that was not officially posted by the state as a coalition does not have the right to make law!
wow congrats . i already apologized for misunderstanding that , and i dont say anything on there i wouldnt say on here , so if think your cool for calling me out on something , you can think again , people need to open there eyes and quit arguing over the same things time and time again , im really surprised people on here are crying more about the situation then anyone on a 4x4 website
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