Property Stones And More... Fall 2022/ Winter Spring 2023

[Teegate]

That is an interesting one. I found that one in May of this year after walking that trail to look for plants and one other item I was checking out. I was surprised to find it because I did not know about it.

In any event, surveyors do not use GPS coordinates, they use State Plane coordinates. That particular location is 2950 2003. You can see the state plane grid in this map which happens to be right where the road from the Pleasant Mills Church to Batsto is located. So this location is 294 2002 and yours is just to the East and North at 295 2003. Any surveyor can go to that monument and plant themselves on top of it and go from that point anywhere and know where they are on the State Plane grid.

After I found this monument I figured out where all the other grid intersections were in the woods around Batsto and visited them. I did not find anything at those locations. I am certain they did not put them at all the grid intersections. They may have used that location to survey Batsto in particular but I really don't know.

My photo from May.

 

[stiltzkin]

After I found this monument I figured out where all the other grid intersections were in the woods around Batsto and visited them. I did not find anything at those locations. I am certain they did not put them at all the grid intersections. They may have used that location to survey Batsto in particular but I really don't know.

Fascinating! Thank you for the backstory. I figured the X and Y must correspond to someone's coordinate system.

So are the State Plane markers all listed somewhere or shown on a map? Where did you find the map that shows X2940 Y2002 at Pleasant Mills?

Is this a system that is still used for surveying, and roughly how old are the markers?

 

[Teegate]

I acquired the map years ago.

Yes, State Plane is the norm. The markers if placed there by the Wharton survey team are from 1954 to 1957 or so.

 

[Boyd]

The State Plane Coordinate System (SPCS) is a map projection that is used for many things. Any GIS software should be able to easily convert between SPCS and the geographic (lat/lon) system that we're more accustomed to. However, it gets somewhat more complicated because of changing standards...

"on most USGS 7.5-minute Historical topographic maps produced 1947-1995, the grid is tied to the outdated North American Datum of 1927 (NAD27), so coordinates on the map might differ by hundreds of meters from coordinates obtained by modern instruments using newer datums.
With the advent of the North American Datum of 1983 (NAD83)--which is virtually identical to the World Geodetic System of 1984 (WGS84) within the United States--State Plane coordinates shifted with it."

What is the State Plane Coordinate System? Can GPS provide coordinates in these values? | U.S. Geological Survey

The State Plane Coordinate System (SPCS), which is only used in the United States, is a plane coordinate system (north-south and east-west lines are perpendicular) in which each individual state has between one to six zones, depending on the state's size and shape. This coordinate system’s high...

www.usgs.gov

 

[stiltzkin]

I tried futzing around with NCAT to see if I could get anywhere, but I am not doing something right. You can select NAD27 as the input datum in this tool though.

 

[RednekF350]

I tried futzing around with NCAT to see if I could get anywhere, but I am not doing something right. You can select NAD27 as the input datum in this tool though.

Stiltzkin,

The coordinate values shown on the monument are X and Y Cartesian coordinates. More importantly, the X value is reduced by a factor of 100 and the Y value is reduced by a factor of 1,000 so that they fit on the monument. You also need to know that X values are Eastings and Y values are Northings.

Therefore, the NAD 1927 input values for the NCAT program are: Northing 2,003,000 Easting 295,000
Input those vales into the NCAT program and you will land right on the spot that Teegate has described.

I am attaching a screen capture of my calculation and as you can see from the map, the point lands where it should.

Enjoy !

Scott

 

[Teegate]

I headed out again alone this morning to search at a few locations for property stones. I headed to Washington Turnpike and along the way saw these.

Chew Road

Near the Hammonton Airport.

When I hear people say they saw a mountain lion or bobcat I always am skeptical. However, this morning on Washington Turnpike I have lost my skepticism. I saw one or the other crossing the turnpike and even have it on video. However, the video makes it seem far away since my camera has a wide angle view. I saw it coming across on the right side of the road, cross over and continue on the other side moving faster than anything I have ever viewed before. It was lower to the ground than a deer and did not look like a deer at all.

It ran in the direction of where I was going in the woods so I was very cautious when searching today. I was again looking for the corners to the Nicolas Sooy property on the main stage road from Washington Tavern to Jonathan Crammers property near Mount. Back in 2011 I found the below stone very close to the property but it does not match up with the deed I have been working with from 1849. I walked around for an hour and came up empty.

From there I looked for other stones along Hawkins Bridge road and then moved to the Wading Pines area along 563 and came up empty for stones as well.

An old gate most likely from the Broome family.

And Washington Turnpike has apparently had some emergency repairs just before or since the rain.

 

[manumuskin]

Can you post the cougar footage? I saw one on the Mullica back in 78,it was ten ft up in a tree and then jumped out and bounded up across Quaker Bridge rd.The people that tell you cougars in NJ are BS are the same ones that will swear they saw Bigfoot next week.

 

[Teegate]

The video shows it so far away it really is not worth it. I will see if I can find a way to make it look better but I don't think it will.

 

[Teegate]

Again, my camera shows things far away, but in reality it was much closer. In any event, I zoomed in and used my camera to film this.

http://teegate.njpinebarrens.com/trash/whatever.MOV

 

[stiltzkin]

Again, my camera shows things far away, but in reality it was much closer. In any event, I zoomed in and used my camera to film this.

http://teegate.njpinebarrens.com/trash/whatever.MOV

Interesting. If you can post a clip of the source video itself rather than a screen recording (?) I know I would pixel peep it.

 

[Teegate]

No. This will have to do. I am not spending anymore time on it.

 

[stiltzkin]

No. This will have to do. I am not spending anymore time on it.

Alright, no worries then. Cool sighting though, whatever it was.

 

[bobpbx]

That looks like a hog, Guy. Way too big for a bobcat and too dark to be a mountain lion (from what I see).

 

[Teegate]

Whatever it was is sure ran fast.

 

[Teegate]

I also looked for two Wharton corners right along the Swago Swamp near the Pineland Community Home at the intersection of 563 and 679. Both corners are from the John Monroe survey of April 18, 1754. The corners had stones there at one time and in more recent years they has Wharton survey monuments. All that is there now is the yellow paint on the trees that points the direction to the monuments which are gone.

 

[Teegate]

And I also looked for a Godfrey Estlow corner on Hawkins Road that should be somewhere close to this dry pond. I should have been there after a recent burn but failed to do so. In any event, I found nothing.

 

[Teegate]

This morning I met up with RednekF350 to look for more of the possible property stones along the Pump Branch. Since Scott has been exploring that area for years we teamed up to cross the stream to look for three stones in particular.

After crossing we followed an old dike most surely made many years ago to build cranberry bogs. The going was tough in some area's and when arriving at the first and second locations we were treated with this. You can't see it but the dike makes a 90 degree turn right there and we agreed this was where we wanted to be. However, we could not see anything.

We continued on following the dike until it ended at the upland. Unfortuanly, we did not find any stone today. But the woods turned more pleasurable and we were surprised at how nice it was back there.

Scott crossing back over the Pump Branch holding his knee boots which we both brought with us.

 

[bobpbx]

What was Scott wearing if he was holding his boots?

 

[Teegate]

What was Scott wearing if he was holding his boots?

We both had hip boots on. I borrowed one of his spare pairs and we took our knee boots across the stream and then changed into them on the other side and changed back to cross the river on the way back.