1839 maps showing mills, furnaces and forges
- Thread starter RMICKLE
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diggersw said:
Here is an update on this post and thread.
All,
I had a chance today to view some maps of the Old Half Way area, and found that the inscribed "EO" stone in this photo that I have posted before stands for Eayre Oliphant a land owner of the Old Half Way area sometime before or during 1907 when the map was drawn.
http://www.njpinebarrens.com/teegate/main.php/download/1290-1/eo.jpg
BTW, there are more to find so I will be busy.
And the mystery of the below stone has been solved. This is the one I have also posted before that I first found with bobpbx and Jeff and others have also visited it.
http://www.njpinebarrens.com/teegate/main.php/download/907-1/SB.jpg
The "SB" stands for Samuel Bryant. He purchased quite a bit of land along the Ocean/Burlington county border near Coyle Field in the 1899 time frame.
I also found the location of a few more stones on the Lawrence line and hope to check on them in the coming months.
Guy
Guy,
If this is the same Samuel Bryant from my Red Oak Grove research, then it may predate 1899. Bryant occupied ROG in the 1850s. He was the Postmaster, and helped form a school in the area. His earliest land acquisition was in 1851. Also, his land was later purchased by Charles Middleton and became part of a lumber tract.
If the SB is correct, then you are looking at an offical property marker in ROG. Plus, if the 1899 date in your research is accurate, then it may have to do with the failed development in Ocean County called Red Oak Park, that was attempted near where ROG shortly lived.
It will be interesting to see just where this marker is located on a USGS.
Scott W.
P.S. Oh, by the way, have you gotten around to editing my article for this site?
If this is the same Samuel Bryant from my Red Oak Grove research, then it may predate 1899. Bryant occupied ROG in the 1850s. He was the Postmaster, and helped form a school in the area. His earliest land acquisition was in 1851. Also, his land was later purchased by Charles Middleton and became part of a lumber tract.
If the SB is correct, then you are looking at an offical property marker in ROG. Plus, if the 1899 date in your research is accurate, then it may have to do with the failed development in Ocean County called Red Oak Park, that was attempted near where ROG shortly lived.
It will be interesting to see just where this marker is located on a USGS.
Scott W.
P.S. Oh, by the way, have you gotten around to editing my article for this site?
diggersw said:Guy,
If this is the same Samuel Bryant from my Red Oak Grove research, then it may predate 1899. Bryant occupied ROG in the 1850s. He was the Postmaster, and helped form a school in the area. His earliest land acquisition was in 1851. Also, his land was later purchased by Charles Middleton and became part of a lumber tract.
If the SB is correct, then you are looking at an offical property marker in ROG. Plus, if the 1899 date in your research is accurate, then it may have to do with the failed development in Ocean County called Red Oak Park, that was attempted near where ROG shortly lived.
It will be interesting to see just where this marker is located on a USGS.
Scott W.
P.S. Oh, by the way, have you gotten around to editing my article for this site?
Scott,
The photo's I took are blurry, so I have to wait until I get a copy of it in a few weeks. But I am certain it shows that the area that I found that SB stone is shown on the map as being owned by him. I have to rely on my memory of the date of the map since the photo I took of that portion is extremely blurry
I can tell you it is not marked on a USGS. I viewed a copy of the original survey that had been updated and altered for accuracy. It shows the bearings and distance between all of the property markers, so I should be able to look for them all. It still is I believe in magnetic north which is a slight problem that I will overcome.
EDITED
Guy
Scott,
I have edited what I wrote above. What I should have said is that you will have to talk to Ben to have your article posted. I do not have access to that portion of the site to be able to add it to the articles.
I hope that clears things up. I was informed that my answer seemed "short" and I am sorry if it seemed that way.
Guy
I have edited what I wrote above. What I should have said is that you will have to talk to Ben to have your article posted. I do not have access to that portion of the site to be able to add it to the articles.
I hope that clears things up. I was informed that my answer seemed "short" and I am sorry if it seemed that way.
Guy
I am looking for more articles for the front page, so anybody that has anything they'd like to contribute should contact me.
Samuel "Bryant" and "Bryant Road"
Is it just a forgone conclusion that "Bryant Road" was named after/for Samuel "Bryant," or does someone have more substantial proof as to the origin of the name "Bryant Road"? On my map, "Bryant Road" is a "fer" piece from Red Oak Grove...
ebsi2001
BEHR655 said:
Is it just a forgone conclusion that "Bryant Road" was named after/for Samuel "Bryant," or does someone have more substantial proof as to the origin of the name "Bryant Road"? On my map, "Bryant Road" is a "fer" piece from Red Oak Grove...
ebsi2001
"SB" Marker
That's a mighty NEW (= "modern") --looking marker, Guy... From your photo, it looks like it could have been cast from Portland Cement. What is the composition of the marker? Were the initials "SB" cast into the marker, or do they look like they may be the work of a stonecutter?
ebsi2001
diggersw said:
That's a mighty NEW (= "modern") --looking marker, Guy... From your photo, it looks like it could have been cast from Portland Cement. What is the composition of the marker? Were the initials "SB" cast into the marker, or do they look like they may be the work of a stonecutter?
ebsi2001
"Old" Halfway/Red Oak Grove--"Reorientation"
Dear Scott,
Can you please explain to me how "...Samuel ["]Bryant["] and his neighbors [went about] re-orienting themselves to better suit a proposed school for the Red Oak Grove area."? Why would they want to do that? Just how large were the communities of "Old" Halfway and "Red Oak Grove"?
ebsi2001
diggersw said:
Dear Scott,
Can you please explain to me how "...Samuel ["]Bryant["] and his neighbors [went about] re-orienting themselves to better suit a proposed school for the Red Oak Grove area."? Why would they want to do that? Just how large were the communities of "Old" Halfway and "Red Oak Grove"?
ebsi2001
I see you are into the genealogy of pinelands families......welcome.
As for the Bryant road, he owned various pieces of property so using Red Oak Grove as a reference may not be the proper way to judge that. But I do not know if the road was named for him or not, but I am willing to bet it is.
I assume you are talking about the EO stone when you mention cement. The "stone" is mentioned on a 1907 map that I have so it is at least that old. Jerseyman has mentioned that cement dates back to the 1880's so it very well could be cement. But officially it is called a stone as far as I am concerned. Usually if it is cement it is called a monument. Then again I am not certain who actually made that decision years ago when my map was made.
Are you interested in the pines genealogy and the actual towns? Have you researched any of them? If so I am interested in anything you would be willing to tell us.
Again, welcome to Ben's site.
Guy
As for the Bryant road, he owned various pieces of property so using Red Oak Grove as a reference may not be the proper way to judge that. But I do not know if the road was named for him or not, but I am willing to bet it is.
I assume you are talking about the EO stone when you mention cement. The "stone" is mentioned on a 1907 map that I have so it is at least that old. Jerseyman has mentioned that cement dates back to the 1880's so it very well could be cement. But officially it is called a stone as far as I am concerned. Usually if it is cement it is called a monument. Then again I am not certain who actually made that decision years ago when my map was made.
Are you interested in the pines genealogy and the actual towns? Have you researched any of them? If so I am interested in anything you would be willing to tell us.
Again, welcome to Ben's site.
Guy
ebsi2001 said:
I don't think a community needed to have that many children to have a school in those days. Have you ever seen the old Friendship school house that is now in Tabernacle? It looks like at most it could accommodate 20 students.
It would make more sense to bring in a teacher for a couple of dollars a month than to try an cart the kids off to another school. The time that would be spent traveling would better used for their chores.
Steve
As per Steve's post, "bring in a teacher for a couple of dollars a month" ???
Sounds like that is below minimum wage, even back then. But I'm sure it included full room and board, with a new wagon and horsies also !!!
Ah, the "good old days" ....
Dave
Sounds like that is below minimum wage, even back then. But I'm sure it included full room and board, with a new wagon and horsies also !!!
Ah, the "good old days" ....
Dave
ebsi2001 said:
I am not entirely sure how big these communities were, however, the timeframe for the school falls into the 1850s / 1860s and does coincide with several industrial ventures in the region. The Lewis Neill Brick works, and later Union Clay, would have needed a place to care for the intellectual development of their children. The application for a school is actually on file at the Ocean County Clerk's office, and mentions Lewis Neill among other people. I do not have my research in front of me right now, but can tell you that the area apparently had enough families to require a school. There were some issues with what district the school should be associated, primarily because ROG spans both Ocean and Burlington counties. But, to my knowledge it ultimately became an Ocean County school.
ebsi2001 --- welcome
Thank you for the welcome, Guy!
There wasn't enough space provided for me to list all of my pertinent interests. The phrase "the genealogy and family history of pinelands families..." would be more exacting, and to the point. I am not just a "date collector." My interest is not in "rewriting," but, rather, in "uncovering" the family histories of Pinelands families; their familial interrelationships; and the influence these families had on the history of the areas in which they lived. Ancillary to this interest, is my interest in photography and GPS to facilitate documentation...
Subordinate interests are: Surface and subsurface archaelogy of southern New Jersey, especially in the Pinelands; the Microbiology of the Pinelands, with special interest in Mycology; and a research interest, which I shall no longer be able to pursue: the Mycorrhizae of the Pinelands and its influence on the ecology of the area...
Again, thanks for the welcome to Ben's site, Guy.
ebsi
TeeGate said:
Thank you for the welcome, Guy!
There wasn't enough space provided for me to list all of my pertinent interests. The phrase "the genealogy and family history of pinelands families..." would be more exacting, and to the point. I am not just a "date collector." My interest is not in "rewriting," but, rather, in "uncovering" the family histories of Pinelands families; their familial interrelationships; and the influence these families had on the history of the areas in which they lived. Ancillary to this interest, is my interest in photography and GPS to facilitate documentation...
Subordinate interests are: Surface and subsurface archaelogy of southern New Jersey, especially in the Pinelands; the Microbiology of the Pinelands, with special interest in Mycology; and a research interest, which I shall no longer be able to pursue: the Mycorrhizae of the Pinelands and its influence on the ecology of the area...
Again, thanks for the welcome to Ben's site, Guy.
ebsi
"'SB' obelisk"
Guy[/QUOTE]
No, Guy, I was referring to the "'SB' obelisk." From your photograph, it looks quite "modern."
After I made my posting, I read the comments you and others made about that "marker," i.e.
--- in an earlier posting.
Granted, people do "weird" things --- nonsensical "exceptions to the rule," so a granite marker in the middle of today's "nowhere" should not necessarily turn heads --- but it is "curious" that someone (a "private person") would go to the expense of errecting a granite marker to mark a simple property line... Additionally, the initials "SB" seem to be cut deeply into the marker. Although the use of granite markers in graveyards came into increasingly popular use by the end of the first quarter of the last century, the cuts are very shallow, the lettering "irregular" at best, and, thus, longer inscriptions are often somewhat "difficult" to decipher. Looking at "your marker," someone took great pains to carve--out the letters "SB" that deeply. I hypothesize that it either it cost a small "bundle" to do, or it was a State or County or Township job, or it was done at the behest of someone with a definite commercial interest in mind(and a pocket full of someone else's "greenbacks")...
In his "front page article," Scott mentions that "He [Samuel "Bryant"]died in 1857..., so it is doubtful that he would have errected this marker in "...the 1899 time frame." [Your posting of 11.04.2006] ("The "SB" stands for Samuel Bryant. He purchased quite a bit of land along the Ocean/Burlington county border near Coyle Field in the 1899 time frame.").
I hypothesize we may be looking at three generations of "Samuel 'Bryants'" --- not necessarily all closely related...
ebsi
Guy[/QUOTE]
No, Guy, I was referring to the "'SB' obelisk." From your photograph, it looks quite "modern."
After I made my posting, I read the comments you and others made about that "marker," i.e.
--that it is granite, and
--that the letters "SB" have been "chiseled"
into the marker.
--- in an earlier posting.
Granted, people do "weird" things --- nonsensical "exceptions to the rule," so a granite marker in the middle of today's "nowhere" should not necessarily turn heads --- but it is "curious" that someone (a "private person") would go to the expense of errecting a granite marker to mark a simple property line... Additionally, the initials "SB" seem to be cut deeply into the marker. Although the use of granite markers in graveyards came into increasingly popular use by the end of the first quarter of the last century, the cuts are very shallow, the lettering "irregular" at best, and, thus, longer inscriptions are often somewhat "difficult" to decipher. Looking at "your marker," someone took great pains to carve--out the letters "SB" that deeply. I hypothesize that it either it cost a small "bundle" to do, or it was a State or County or Township job, or it was done at the behest of someone with a definite commercial interest in mind(and a pocket full of someone else's "greenbacks")...
In his "front page article," Scott mentions that "He [Samuel "Bryant"]died in 1857..., so it is doubtful that he would have errected this marker in "...the 1899 time frame." [Your posting of 11.04.2006] ("The "SB" stands for Samuel Bryant. He purchased quite a bit of land along the Ocean/Burlington county border near Coyle Field in the 1899 time frame.").
I hypothesize we may be looking at three generations of "Samuel 'Bryants'" --- not necessarily all closely related...
ebsi
Portland cement
Some maintain that the ancient Egyptians cast the blocks for the great pyramids out of "cement." It would not, necessarily, surprise me, since we know that they had antibiotics and performed brain surgery, too...
As for "monuments": I call smaller grave markers "headstones," and the big "dealies" --- mostly in the middle of plots --- "monuments"... Then, I refer to their composition (as far as I can ascertain)...
ebsi
TeeGate said:
Some maintain that the ancient Egyptians cast the blocks for the great pyramids out of "cement." It would not, necessarily, surprise me, since we know that they had antibiotics and performed brain surgery, too...
As for "monuments": I call smaller grave markers "headstones," and the big "dealies" --- mostly in the middle of plots --- "monuments"... Then, I refer to their composition (as far as I can ascertain)...
ebsi
Red Oak Grove "School District"
Steve,
One not need to go all the way to Tabernacle --- just down the road a piece, in Warren Grove, there was a one--room schoolhouse. I have no clue what happened to it. Perhaps it was "recycled" as a "gunning club" (abnd still exists ) or some carpetbagger tore it down to put--up one of those three--story, plastic--wrapped "cheese boxes" that seem so popular these days...
I have no problem there being a schoolhouse in Red Oak Grove in the mid--to--late 1850s: Makes sense to me...
My question involves Scotts useage of the term "re--orienting" in the sentence "...Samuel ["]Bryant["] and his neighbors [went about] re-orienting themselves to better suit a proposed school for the Red Oak Grove area." What does he mean by "re--orienting," and why would Samuel Bryant want the Red Oak Grove School to be in Ocean County??
ebsi
BEHR655 said:
Steve,
One not need to go all the way to Tabernacle --- just down the road a piece, in Warren Grove, there was a one--room schoolhouse. I have no clue what happened to it. Perhaps it was "recycled" as a "gunning club" (abnd still exists
) or some carpetbagger tore it down to put--up one of those three--story, plastic--wrapped "cheese boxes" that seem so popular these days...I have no problem there being a schoolhouse in Red Oak Grove in the mid--to--late 1850s: Makes sense to me...
My question involves Scotts useage of the term "re--orienting" in the sentence "...Samuel ["]Bryant["] and his neighbors [went about] re-orienting themselves to better suit a proposed school for the Red Oak Grove area." What does he mean by "re--orienting," and why would Samuel Bryant want the Red Oak Grove School to be in Ocean County??
ebsi