How do we stop the damage?

92 Blazer Jeff

Explorer
Aug 24, 2015
259
100
GLASSBORO,NJ
An interesting location. In reality that is state property for about 150 out into the pond. The map below shows the current proper line with the state owning to the left and NJCF owning to the right. However, there has been some funny dealings going on in recent years as the actual state property from the north crossed the pond to the stone and then turned west to the line. I have maps showing most of that land being owned by the state. So whatever happened over the years has taken some of the pond from us.


The purple line is the gate location and the location of the previous views.


fb.jpg



Guy
I see you are wright that is part of Wharton not NJCF. I remember seeing the NJCF signs on the road to it from Friendship Speedwell Rd.
 

Broke Jeep Joe

Explorer
Mar 8, 2006
636
332
Waterford Twp
Every single unblocked ORV site that I monitor has fresh tracks going through it- this includes Jemima Mt which has a gate, but the gate alone has proven insufficient. We had 10 volunteers go and watch locations last Monday and we made 5 calls to the DEP Hotline to report 12 illegal drivers/riders during the course of 3 and 1/2 hours, but no police ever responded. So I am asking for your ideas, how do we stop this?


IMG_2725 by Jason Howell, on Flickr



IMG_2727 by Jason Howell, on Flickr

IMG_2718 by Jason Howell, on Flickr

Monday as in Labor Day? I'm sure the SPP and other LEO's were out and staffed. Whenever I have called something in, be it a trash pile or stuck vehicle, etc. I always received a call back from the responding officer.
 

Teegate

Administrator
Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
23,149
5,027
Wow! This is an incredible recovery. I was just there early this summer and walked the whole meadow, admiring it. This seems like a perfect case of what can be done with some physical protections. It is totally protected, yet totally accessible from the adjacent road.


That shows that no matter how bad something looks it will recover if left alone.
 

46er

Piney
Mar 24, 2004
8,838
2,125
Coastal NJ
I hope in the future this might change.

I sincerely doubt it. He is trained to pick and choose what to respond to, but will say just about anything to get that elusive map back. They now attack the DEP, their buddies when the MAP was released, and now throw them, and Rob Auermuller, under the bus.

“I don’t blame the Park Police. They are doing what they can,” said PPA Stewardship Coordinator Jason Howell, who organized the effort. “They want to stop this but DEP refused to provide the tools they need to succeed. Namely a map.”
 

Jason Howell

Explorer
Nov 23, 2009
126
50
Agreed (and I agree on the Hunters having access to CH Road). Progress is progress. We can get much more accomplished going to Trenton with a unified front hammered out of compromise.

Some great responses here. Jason, I'd like to see you engage the points being made.


I completely agree that the State Park Police need more funding and will gladly join an effort to support that. The lack of response on labor day is probably because of how many ATV calls they were getting that day. I hope to have an exact account soon. Dispatchers also assign an urgency to a complaint and if an officer is already on a call, then they will not be able to respond to a new complaint.
 

Jason Howell

Explorer
Nov 23, 2009
126
50
Please tell me why your new opinion here didn't make the article.

It's not a new opinion. I always chuckle a bit when someone makes me out to be some kind of experienced political operative. Before last year I was a photographer and cinematographer exclusively. I have never lived anywhere else but the Pine Barrens(travelling for work) and got passionate about this issue because I am in a long term personal film making project on the natural wonders of the pines. Coming to a place that I have never been to and finding it annihilated before I get a chance to see it is quite galvanizing.

My last film project http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/review/spring-tribeca-review-884272
 

smoke_jumper

Piney
Mar 5, 2012
1,131
576
Atco, NJ
You really didn't answer my question. I understand your passion as I hope you understand mine. Flooding a dispatcher with calls is easy to do on a busy holiday. Assigning priorities is the only to take care of the back log. For any first responder I'm sure chasing kids on quads slides down the ladder a bit compared to all the other calls they have to respond to. Making it seem like they are ineffective only undermines everything they are trying to do. If the people breaking the laws think the risk of getting caught is as low as you make it seem then they will still do it.
The SPP are severely under funded but they are doing a much more effective job then they were able to do a year ago. They should be commended
 

Jason Howell

Explorer
Nov 23, 2009
126
50
You really didn't answer my question. I understand your passion as I hope you understand mine.
.... If the people breaking the laws think the risk of getting caught is as low as you make it seem then they will still do it.
The SPP are severely under funded but they are doing a much more effective job then they were able to do a year ago. They should be commended

I do commend them, often and in person. The DEP has put the full weight of this on their underfunded, overworked, and commendable police force. They have abdicated any management role in the solution, which needs to be addressed.

The ORV use is still intense out there. Every monitored location that has not been physically barricaded has fresh tracks going into it. Not only that but they are constantly working to undermine the barricades, including at Jemima. This is why we need far more of these barricades and they need to be monitored often for effectiveness.
 

Tony

Scout
Jul 30, 2015
43
20
69
Folsom
Listen guys Jason is making a lot of this stuff up because he wants the MAP back. So he makes up stories
About new damage and that the police do not respond to calls. It all BS.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mowergod

Piney4life

Explorer
Oct 8, 2015
368
106
48
Waterford
They(dep) are underfunded because of the open space ballot lie that cut the dep sps funding but that was the plan the whole time for the kig group to take over all state lands
 

46er

Piney
Mar 24, 2004
8,838
2,125
Coastal NJ
They(dep) are underfunded because of the open space ballot lie that cut the dep sps funding but that was the plan the whole time for the kig group to take over all state lands

Not sure any lies were in the ballot question, but it was craftily worded. You had to read it a couple times to see 'yes' was not a good choice. Most folks see 'Open Space' and just vote for it. Now it is a constitutional amendment.

https://ballotpedia.org/New_Jersey_...nding_Amendment,_Public_Question_No._2_(2014)
 

NJPinesExplorer

New Member
Sep 14, 2016
1
4
33
Mount Laurel, NJ
I'm a long-time lurker around here, but felt I could add to this discussion, so I signed up.

I've been regularly visiting the Pines since the late 90's when I was ~10 years old. My uncle taught me about and took me to many of the historic locations throughout Wharton. I've also canoed and/or kayaked the rivers just about every summer since.

In 2013 I bought a small street legal dual sport motorcycle so I could better access and explore the forest. I've been riding through the pines regularly the past 4 summer seasons. I could see the changes in the forest compared to 10 years earlier. The damage wasn't to the extent that some have portrayed it, but there were clearly locations being abused. I attended the MAP meeting in Hammonton in 2015 to voice concern regarding the MAP and advocate for increased enforcement instead. In the years I had been riding out in Wharton, I maybe saw park police once...in 3 years. I'm happy to say that after the MAP meeting, I noticed the increased presence of park police (am I using the right term here?) almost immediately. While riding down High Crossing Road, before it was closed, two officers were waiting at the entrance to 1/4 mile. Excellent! I struck up a conversation with them for a bit.

More recently, I was actually on the accidental receiving end of the increased enforcement. I stopped by Apple Pie Hill with a friend on Labor Day on our dual sport motorcycles. Park police were on the scene and stopped us to check documents. While providing our licenses/reg/insurance, a group of young folks came down the fire tower, and the officer called them over to write tickets. Then a pair of un-tagged dirt bikes came ripping down New York Ave, but as soon as they saw the police truck they took off. The officer was visibly frustrated at the lack of staffing to handle all of this. Unfortunately for me, my registration had expired while I was on business travel and I neglected to renew it before going on the ride. So the officer wrote me a ticket for which I have to go to court in October. Oooops. You know I won't let my registration expire again!

My point in all of this us that there is a definiteincrease in park police presence in Wharton over the last year, the officers are working hard to enforce the law and stop abuse, and it seems to be having an effect! Given time and more staffing, the increased enforcement could make a big impact and significantly reduce the abuse, so folks that just want to get out and explore while sticking to the open roads on legal vehicles can continue to enjoy the forest.

P.S. This forum is absolutely wonderful! I've read so many incredible threads on the history of the Pines and learned so much!
 

RednekF350

Piney
Feb 20, 2004
4,588
2,316
Pestletown, N.J.
I received the email below today from the NJOA. Their name was dragged around a little in an article in an online news rag called NJ Spotlight. Click on the link to read what was said in the article.
The NJOA rebuttal is included
I know I've seen the photograph used in the article somewhere before. :)

"The New Jersey Outdoor Alliance was recently taken to task and mis-quoted by an "environmental" writer from the online publication NJ Spotlight. They claimed to have discussed the views of NJOA and included direct quotes describing NJOA political action from a so called Enviromental Organization pertaining to the Motorized Access Plan at Wharton . None of which was true. The article is rife with fabricated information!



Here is the article in question. http://www.njspotlight.com/stories/...struggle-to-reach-fragile-peace-in-pinelands/



NJOA Trustees have released this response and circulated it to the editors of NJ Spotlight. NJOA has your back!





NJSPOTLIGHT article on Wharton rife with off-road errors



"We at the New Jersey Outdoor Alliance (NJOA) would like to address errors and omissions in the recent NJ Spotlight article “Conservationists Fear Off- Roaders Will Damage N.J. Pinelands,” by John Hurdle. Firstly, Mr. Hurdle wrote that no one from the NJOA respond to a request for comment. The fact is that no one contacted NJOA for comment. But, we welcome to opportunity to respond.



Some background is in order. In the fall of 2015 the NJOA received calls from stakeholder groups that roads in Wharton State Forest were being marked with “Closed” signs. At this point in time, very few users of Wharton State Forest, or the municipalities that surrounded the forest, were even aware of a Motorized Access Plan (M.A.P.). In response, NJOA requested a meeting with the Division of Parks and Forestry to better understand the process of road closures. Contrary to statements in article, no lobbyist was hired by NJOA; we do not employ a lobbyist. NJOA representatives attended all meetings.



During the meeting we were informed that a MAP had not yet been implemented and that no roads had been closed. We later found out that this was not true, and that several Non-Government Organizations had helped formulate the initial plan and had started closing roads before the M.A.P. was unveiled.



We requested a tour of Wharton State Park on behalf of conservation stakeholders in order to review the trails and roads that were marked for closure under M.A.P. At this time there were conflicting reports about the condition of important trails and roads. During this review NJOA requested a list of criteria being used to determine road closures. We were not given a list nor provided concise answers. We did witness that some trails and roads should be closed, and also that some should have never even been created. Additionally, some were made by illegal vehicle use and by using old fire cuts. Importantly, we did discover from our meeting and tour that the M.A.P. was not implemented with full public disclosure, which was of concern to many conservationists and stakeholder groups since M.A.P. was negatively impacting public access.



In response, NJOA requested the D.E.P. to provide public meetings so that the M.A.P. could be detailed for all user groups and allow for public commentary. This is a fundamental requirement of good government and management of public resources. In fact, public meetings and commentary is perfunctory in most cases.



Contrary to Mr. Hurdle’s article, NJOA never contacted the Governor’s office. As a result of public meetings and public commentary a comprehensive list of procedures and criteria were integrated into the M.A.P. and provided to the public. Signs were posted that explained the current regulations to users entering the forest and a comprehensive plan provided for the entire forest road system. Included in this plan was repair and maintenance of the roads; something that has not been addressed in more than 25 years. Also, NJOA requested an increased law enforcement presence to apprehend and prosecute violators of the current laws and statutes. This was also included in the revised M.A.P. NJOA firmly believes that public input allowed the D.E.P.to better fulfill its obligation to both the public and natural resource management. In fact, NJOA was founded on the principle of conservation and natural resource stewardship.



We are proud of the efforts of D.E.P. and the end result of the M.A.P. We believe this was properly corrected by D.E.P. and is a testimony to its dedication and commitment to both the environment and the public who relies on it.



We are also pleased that NJOA may have played a role in an improved M.A.P.



Respectfully Submitted New Jersey Outdoor Alliance Trustees"

www.njoutdooralliance.org

Scott
 

Teegate

Administrator
Site Administrator
Sep 17, 2002
23,149
5,027
I'm a long-time lurker around here, but felt I could add to this discussion, so I signed up.


P.S. This forum is absolutely wonderful! I've read so many incredible threads on the history of the Pines and learned so much!


Glad you joined. Welcome!

Guy
 
Top