ORV Management In Sensitive Areas Of Wharton

[SuperChooch]

Outdoorgirl, I think you might have just misunderstood Teegate. He is just saying this is the their way to actually make a ticket stick. If the maps are published, you could no longer claim that that you didn't know you couldn't be there. Hence the saying "ignorance of the law is no excuse". It was not directed at you.

 

[Teegate]

That was not a jab. I was just stating that ignorance of the law is no excuse. It was not directed at anyone. If someone from another state just drove over for the day and did not know a road was closed and got caught, they would be fined or whatever and ignorance of the law is no excuse because there is a map telling you what roads to be on.

I did not insult anyone.

 

[SuperChooch]

Just an update on Dave's meeting yesterday. There were 50+ in attendance and it was a great discussion. I passed around a paper petition that contained the letter I posted earlier in the thread and got 50 signatures. I'm sending copies to District 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, 12, (Districts represented last night) Governor Christie and Lt Governor Guadagno tomorrow. Dave collected everyone's email addresses.

BUT THIS IS NOT ENOUGH! If you have not done so, please call or email you state Senator and Assembly, the Governor and Lt Governor. Let them know how you feel!

Stay tuned for additional plans.

 

[Outdoorgirl]

It's all good! This is just something that I'm very passionate about, as a hunter, a woodser, and an Aunt that likes to load up her nieces and nephews and take the out for a little geocaching, exploring the outdoors is where we as a family can just talk and have fun . I'm better at that than a mall. Lol.

 

[pinelandpaddler]

Just about every turn off is there and no overgrown because it goes somewhere scenic, or somewhere where there used to be something, such as locks bridge which is BOTH. Stupid stupid stupid to let nature further erase places like that from existence. Words cannot express how upset this makes a vehicular explorer like me feel. I don't hike anymore, I'd rather not deal with the Mosquitos, chiggers, ticks, and everything else!

Guess if I want to see the forest now I'll have to buy a drone... Until they ban that!

I'm not happy about these closures either, but let's not be unreasonable. The locks bridge area will not further be erased due to the lack of vehicular traffic. I also don't like summertime hiking in the Pines for the reasons you listed, which is why I reserve that activity for the other seasons.

 

[tsqurd]

This whole thing is really bothering me. In reading some of the posts here, newjerseyhunter, and a few other sites, there seems to be a lot of finger pointing, blame, etc ("it's the Jeeps", "it's the ATVs", or the general "it's the offroaders") and "it doesn't really impact me" attitude. We can't forget this policy has been directly linked to the Pinelands PRESERVATION Alliance (http://www.pinelandsalliance.org/downloads/pinelandsalliance_576.pdf)

The bottom line, is they ultimately don't want ANYONE in the forest - they are, as their name states preservationists. Their mission statement states this explicitly (http://www.pinelandsalliance.org/support/about/mission/). While it's easily confused, I bet most of us here, and everywhere really, are really conservationists, not preservationists. It's not an insignificant difference that the US National Park Service defines nicely: "Put simply conservation seeks the proper use of nature, while preservation seeks protection of nature from use" (http://www.nps.gov/klgo/learn/education/classrooms/conservation-vs-preservation.htm)

They may be blaming the 4X4's today, but you are a fool if you don't think you and I won't be in their cross hairs tomorrow.

 

[Ben Ruset]

I think that, pretty much, we're in their crosshairs now.

That being said, that ORV plan that you linked to is from 2011. We need to know what happened that finally allowed Auermueller to close these roads. The PPA, in and of itself, can't make a policy like that law. Something happened somewhere to get this process started. That's what we need to figure out.

Unfortunately we can't "follow the money" so to speak since Auermueller has decided that he doesn't need to explain what is going on to anybody. Maybe it'll be printed on the other side of this so called map he keeps speaking about.

 

[smoke_jumper]

I live close enough to the Wharton that I can hear the quads and dirt bikes. While sitting in my house this weekend each one I heard just made me more and more angry. I keep hearing it's a small price to pay to walk instead of drive in the woods. Considering they're still there I think it's a rather large price to pay.
I personally don't have anything against them. I'm just jealous that they can still go out there. Having less people out there actually makes it easier for them to do so.

 

[46er]

I just find it too coincidental that these closures began just after the PPA's outdoor adventure business began. Does anyone know if Mick's or Bel Haven were notified about the closures?

http://www.courierpostonline.com/st...r-offers-canoe-hiking-history-tours/26598277/

http://www.pinelandsadventures.org/launch/

 

[smoke_jumper]

I just find it too coincidental that these closures began just after the PPA's outdoor adventure business began. Does anyone know if Mick's or Bel Haven were notified about the closures?

http://www.courierpostonline.com/st...r-offers-canoe-hiking-history-tours/26598277/

http://www.pinelandsadventures.org/launch/

And the locations of the first closures too.

 

[Boyd]

Found this old NJTLC thread, it is no longer here at NJPB, but the internet never fogets. I remember that gipsie said she was working with Auermueller to develop a map of Wharton back around the same time but can't find that thread. It might have been an PM, since we discussed mapmaking.

https://web.archive.org/web/2011041...s/8086-new-jersey-trail-lovers-coalition.html

______________________________________

12-05-10 09:11 AM
gipsie

Officials at Wharton State Forest have been taking a serious look at a lot of the damage being done to some sensitive areas of the woods. This has prompted them to consider closing some of the trails/roads and to limit access to our favorite playground.
……….

We are working directly with the superintendent of WSF. He is a good guy and is willing to listen to our help, suggestions and alternatives.

 

[manumuskin]

Time for some civil disobedience.Anybody up for a woods drive?

 

[smoke_jumper]

Relatively poor rating too

http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=7123#.VcC9zIr3asM

 

[tsqurd]

I think that, pretty much, we're in their crosshairs now.

That being said, that ORV plan that you linked to is from 2011. We need to know what happened that finally allowed Auermueller to close these roads. The PPA, in and of itself, can't make a policy like that law. Something happened somewhere to get this process started. That's what we need to figure out.

I agree we are in the crosshairs, just surprised at the number of people that don't realize it.

Also, I don't know there had to be a specific event that triggered this. It may have been nothing more than Auermueller finally convincing his superiors or the PPA beating their drums long enough to get action, etc.

 

[46er]

Found this old NJTLC thread, it is no longer here at NJPB, but the internet never fogets.

Very true, and the Wayback Machine goes back really far. I found posts of mine on other sites back in the 1990's

Here is one for this site for 10/16/2004

https://web.archive.org/web/20041016013341/http://forums.njpinebarrens.com/

I really need to get out more

 

[Ben Ruset]

Seeing that forum software/color scheme brings back memories.

 

[JeepWagoneer]

Are the NJ Pine barrens maps here going to be updated to include an ORV friendly overlay of some sort assuming they ever release the maps?

btw those maps awesome btw, whoever took the time to upload the historic satellite imagery as well as historic and current topos, you are awesome, between those and the rotatable birds eye view in the new Bing maps, it's pretty easy to find just about everything these days!

 

[SuperChooch]

Hi all,

Wanted to let you know that I've heard back from my Senator. I am from the 9th District. Sen Connors, through a member of this staff, relayed that he had received around ten letters to date from his constituency. He expressed our concerns to the DEP Commissioner and the DEP is in internal discussions on how to address the restrictions and the lack of communication. They assured Senator Connors that they would respond to his office.

That should serve as some motivation for anyone who as not contacted their state Senator's office/. 10 letters are not going to do it. (Although I'm sure the neighboring districts to Sen Connors are also getting letters) We need to push accelerator to the floor folks! Send those emails!

 

[mordecai]

Hey all, I implore everyone to remember that we are allies here and this is a dispute among friends. If we didn't have impassioned people like you all and the PPA with deep convictions, then we would have lost this place to suburbia. That fight against the wal-marts and the real-estate companies is not over and I really would like to keep this debate friendly because we need each other.

 

[1Jerseydevil]

This intersection was closed from both sides from three trees being dropped. There were more at one time laying across the road but someone else used a saw to open the road again. Definitely looks to be the same style of a clean cut from a chain saw. I think the situation has brought out some of the more radical activists. There is no way to get around these trees either, if you come up on them you have to reverse out! I was on foot walking back to my car when I came across the closing.

http://maps.njpinebarrens.com/#lat=39.676221385669166&lng=-74.3716575543213&z=17&type=hybrid&gpx=

About 2 months ago I came across another road totally blocked from both ends by chain sawed trees. Of course I had to investigate. The trees are almost the entire length of the road. It appears someone started to clear the trees then someone cut more trees across the sections that was "cleaned". This may have happened during hunting season but is certainly fresh from this past winter, early Spring as the pine needles at the time were still green. I don't have pictures but looks similar to the one Outdoorgirl posted.
http://maps.njpinebarrens.com/#lat=39.744061418405884&lng=-74.34669959943772&z=16&type=hybrid&gpx=